Unstoppable Fighters Beaten by Brilliant Strategy 2 - Ali|Norton, Gibson|Hoost, Louis|Schmeling

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by mark ant, Oct 11, 2019 at 2:56 PM.


  1. mark ant

    mark ant Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    Study on the tactics Schmeling and Norton used to cause two famous upsets, does this prove tactics can overcome ability sometimes?
     
  2. HOUDINI

    HOUDINI Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Schmeling was a great fighter. Devastating right hand puncher and a brilliant tactician. Today it’s lost to time the sensation and impact Schmeling created when he came to the US in the late 20’s. Thousands were turned away from his bouts in NY. Max was either hwt champion or a leading hwt contender from 1928 to his loss to Louis in 1938.
     
  3. Tramell

    Tramell Well-Known Member Full Member

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    JMM beating Pac
    Hopkins beating undefeated Trinidad
    Quintana beating undefeated Williams
     
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  4. mark ant

    mark ant Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    Yes JMM knew he could get Pac with that counter right, he kept trying to slip it in their and finally Manny made that mistake, Trinidad was too small at middle and couldn`t take those punches well, he was floored at welter a few times by lesser punchers than B-hop at a smaller weight, Williams wan`t in Pac`s class.
     
  5. Tramell

    Tramell Well-Known Member Full Member

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    I think his win over Joppy @ MW allowed some to think he could take a MW punch. I was a part of that bunch, so I'm guilty! Joppy went on for 7 years before getting stopped himself (had to look that up!) that made it all the more logic for Tito to campaign @ MW; he can ko MWs & he take it from one MW namely Joppy.

    & williams as in Paul was a WW, he moved up because neither Floyd nor Manny mentioned his name, let alone initials.
     
  6. mark ant

    mark ant Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    But Williams was amazingly taall for a welter and should have been to benefit from his extra long reach like Hearns did at the higher weights. Did people really think Joppy was near B-hop`s level back then?
     
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  7. Tramell

    Tramell Well-Known Member Full Member

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    yeah that reach IMO made FLoyd semi retire. That was exactly when he left.

    As far as Joppy really don't remember. Online forums were really just beginning so all my boxing info came via magazines or Saturdays at the barber shop!
     
  8. George Crowcroft

    George Crowcroft Youngest Ezzard Charles Fan Ever Full Member

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    The issue was that his pure aggressive style didn't really allow him to
     
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  9. roughdiamond

    roughdiamond You're not going to do it for free Full Member

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  10. mark ant

    mark ant Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    Do you think Qawi had more talent than Spinks then?
     
  11. Ken Ashcroft

    Ken Ashcroft Well-Known Member Full Member

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    Ali was hardly considered unbeatable when Ken Norton beat him in 1973. Joe Frazier had already achieved that feat two years earlier.
     
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  12. mark ant

    mark ant Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    Yes but Ali looked trim and sharp in his rematch v Frazier, Norton still needed clever tactics to beat the still superior Ali who went on to give a great performance v Foreman where he displayed quick counter punching hand speed that Norton just didn`t have.
     
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  13. roughdiamond

    roughdiamond You're not going to do it for free Full Member

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    Both very, very talented fighters with very different physical attributes and mentalities. I couldn't really differentiate them that way, to be honest Mark.
     
  14. Fergy

    Fergy Boxing Addict Full Member

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    That s true Ken, and imo even if Ali hadn't lost to Norton, he'd have still been seen as finished or at least way past best.
     
  15. mark ant

    mark ant Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    oh okay, you were just saying Spinks used a specific gameplan to overcome Qawi`s nifty head movement.
     
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