Usyk Confirmed Undisputed P4P No 1

Loma
Golovkin
Usyk
Kovalev
Bivol
Gassiev
Gvoz

That’s a spiced list

 

Oh boy, where to begin... From the start, I guess? This may get long.

Absolute myth. The WBC is as damned as the rest of them; it may not have as many plastic titles as the WBA but it has just as many (if not more) shady rulings influenced by one thing and one thing only - money. Between letting various fighters hold their belt hostage against terrible opposition and the ludicrous "benefit of the doubt" granted to Mexican fighters like Canelo and Nery, the WBC has dragged itself through the dirt as much as any of the other three organisations.

97.4% of those knockouts came against cans. He has one good knockout against Ortiz, and one good decision against a half decent version of Stiverne, but Joshua would KO every other sucker on the 38-long list of names.

Oh, OK, so now we're free to grant wins to any fighter we like based purely on what ifs and lesser informed opinions? I must have missed that memo...
I'm not entirely clued up about the Povetkin saga, or whether lab results came to a decisive conclusion about whether he was genuinely cheating or still had meldonium in his system from before it was banned, so I'll concede here and just say he was stupid. But that doesn't in the slightest mean that Wilder gets the name on his ledger because a fight with Povetkin is far from a foregone conclusion, especially when Wilder has been hurt by far lesser fighters than the Russian. As for Joshua and Fury, well now you're really doing some mental gymnastics. I don't like Fury, nor did I like the amount of chatter he came out with whilst gorging himself on hedgehogs and Colombian marching powder, but are you really suggesting that Wilder deserves credit for Fury's self destruction? What about Wlad for that matter, or any other sucker that may or may not have fought Fury had he not been absent for two years? As for Joshua, you've reached your conclusion based entirely on what the two parties have released to the press knowing nothing about what goes on behind closed doors. I, and many others here, believe Wilder is pricing himself out (still demanding 50/50 lmao) and is more interested in posturing than he is about actually wanting the fight. But does that mean I give Joshua extra credit? No, because I'm not the kind of idiot that throws merit around like candy and does so based purely on the conjecture of situations I know nothing about. "Wilder should have Sasha, Fury and AJ on his resume"? GTFOH with that BS.

That's true, but that does nothing to negate the fact that he has notably struggled against a string of mediocre opposition. For a list that prizes resume and the eye test, I think Wilder is the very antithesis of a P4P fighter. He has one good win and has shown a sever lack of fundamental skills against many of his other wins (and we're not even sure how good that one win is due to Ortiz's inactivity and lack of good wins himself). From a guy that gave him his due praise for beating Ortiz; that is objective criticism backed up by the replays of his fights, no sane mind can watch his fights against Szpilka, Washington and Molina and say to themselves "I think this guy is P4P material".

First of all, it's super flyweight, get it right. Second of all, you are entirely wrong, plenty of people give a rat's arse about 115, so much so that the Superfly card got a successful sequel, with a third possibly on the horizon. Finally (and most importantly), why TF does that matter? Gonzalez x2 and Estrada back to back to back is as good a run of wins as anybody in the entire sport, but you dismiss that simply because you don't care? Since when did the P4P list become a ****ing popularity contest? And if you think popularity is important enough to bump Rungvisai off the list entirely then why aren't Joshua and Canelo at #1 and 2? Because you're an inconsistent moron. "Nobody cares about his incredible achievements and that's enough to nullify said achievements" - Jesus ****ing wept, I've never read such a shithouse explanation for such a shithouse exclusion.

I've never been one for the list as I find it is damn near impossible to maintain consistency around how you regard each criteria, but I'm fairly sure I can scratch my head and come up with a better list than your own.

1) Usyk (Equal parts resume and eye test. He went undisputed, on the road in possibly the best generation of CWs ever, and looked damn good doing it)
2) Loma (Largely eye test, but strongly reinforced by being 3 weight WC and beating Linares)
3) Rungvisai (Mostly resume, moderately reinforced by adaptability shown in both Superfly cards)
4) Golovkin (Almost purely on eye test)
5) Crawford (Mostly eye test, moderately helped by becoming undisputed and being a 3 weight WC)
6) Inoue (Largely eye test, strongly reinforced by being 3 weight WC, suspect he will climb significantly in the WBSS)
7) Mikey (Largely eye test, but being 4 weight WC doesn't hurt. Really needs a BIG fight though to climb higher, only 1 title defense and 0 unification isn't good enough for a guy as clearly talented as he is.
8) Spence (Mostly eye test, but grinding down Brook in Sheffield was a great marquee win, winner of Crawford/Spence goes into the top 3)
9) Kovalev (Equal parts resume and eye test)
10) Canelo (About 60/40 in favour of resume which is a very good one, but is bumped down for having quite a few *s over certain wins.

 

Wilder wouldn’t be on my list and Joshua would be at the bottom I was speaking purely about the list in front of me

 

Usyk
Lomachenko
GGG
Crawford
Eroll Spence
Wilder
Joshua
Mickey Garcia
Inoue

 

Still not on Srisaket's level of resume. He has 3 wins that are each hands down better than any of Usyk's. Not even debatable.

Regardless, Usyk is very good with a solid resume. Clearly at the top of the P4P discussion but just as clearly not on that Srisaket or Lomo level.

 

The difference between Crawford and Wilder is in resume, accomplishments and skills.

Although Crawford being recognized "lineal" 135lb champion by the Ring Magazine (by beating a random contender in Beltran and not a true LW champ Richar Abril) is a joke, he still did defeat some recognized fighters and champions throughout 3 difference weight divisions.

135 - Wins over Burns and Gamboa are not exactly A class, but still those guys are better than most of Wilder's title opponents. They had still won titles in multiple weight classes.
140 - Postol, Diaz and Indongo are solid (not elite though) wins. Neither opponent is great, but Postol happened to be the #2 guy at the time, coming off a KO win over Matthysse, and Indongo was undefeated WBA/IBF unified champion, coming off wins against Troyanovsky in Russia and Burns in Britain. Crawford also unified all 4 belts and became the undisputed champion.
147 - Horn. Not an A class fighter, but still a titleholder (still better and more accomplished than most of Wilder's title opponents).

Like you said, despite a suspect list of opponents, Crawford is still a 3 weight world champion, and has won all 4 titles at 140.

Wilder has no depth in his resume whatsoever. In 8 title fights, he did have 1 A class opponent in Luis Ortiz, but the rest are ridiculously bad, and not anywhere near enough to provide a status of top 10 P4P, and obviously not good enough for a reasonable comparison to Crafword's resume. Not to mention that Wilder hasn't unified any titles so far.

I looked at Crawford's resume from the constructive criticism angle. I don't think that it's necessary to do the same with opponents such as Stiverne, Arreola, Szpila, Duhaupas, Molina and Washington because the situation is very clear. Those guys are not good.

 

He beats on smaller men. Gonzalez has no business at 115.

Talented fighter, but he beats on guys the size of middle schoolers

 

I'm not talking about Usyk and Srisaket fighting each other.

If we stack up and rate the best wins between Usyk and Srisaket, Srisaket has the top 3 and it'd be awkward as hell for anyone to say otherwise.

 

Usyk has beat men his own size

 

[confused smiley face with one eye raised] My statement stands.

 

Usyk gave Gassiev a master class last night.

I'm scratching my head trying to come up with any CW who could have beaten him on that form (which was markedly better form than he showed against Briedis). I suppose David Haye could have landed a bomb on him because David's sheer athleticism circa 2007-8 was ridiculous - but I can't think of anybody who was going to beat him on the cards.

Wouldn't be surprised if Gassiev makes the bigger waves at HW, though, when they both move up. Usyk's gonna need to sit into his punches more at HW.

 

Nonito is butthurt

The two Ukrainians are on top, deal with it!

 

Naoya Inoue 16 fights 14KOs world Titles in 3 weights for me is as good as anyone in p4p.
Lomachenko could be said to be top both him & Inoue are @ the top for me.
Usyk has skills,but to be as high as these 2 he needs to clear out the HWs.