Usyk's cruiserweight run counts toward his Heavyweight greatness

Discussion in 'World Boxing Forum' started by Slyk, Dec 22, 2024.


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  1. Cojimar 1946

    Cojimar 1946 Well-Known Member Full Member

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    The bigger guys in those eras were pretty poor though and couldn't make it into the top 10. Liston's biggest opponents who were close to being world-class were Clark and Williams at 215. There's plenty of cases of cruiserweights today taking over weight matches against poor heavyweights and knocking them out so many are tested against bigger men but not of any quality
     
    Cojimar 1946, Dec 23, 2024
    Cojimar 1946, Dec 23, 2024
    #31
    HistoryZero26 likes this.
  2. Dynamicpuncher

    Dynamicpuncher Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    Fair enough but I'm NGL I get tired of him keep repeating this Cruiserweight argument he does it constantly in every thread its a bit tiresome no offence.
     
    Dynamicpuncher, Dec 23, 2024
    Dynamicpuncher, Dec 23, 2024
    #32
    Pugguy likes this.
  3. Pugguy

    Pugguy Ingo, The Thinking Man’s GOAT Full Member

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    No worries. It’s a group discussion at any rate but figured that you might’ve mistook it as a direct reply to you since it immediately followed your post.

    I agree, and although certain and relevant key differences have been highlighted, they don’t seem to have necessarily been taken on board - respect to all opinions but I personally don’t factor and merge Usyk’s CW career into his HW resume.
     
    Pugguy, Dec 23, 2024
    Pugguy, Dec 23, 2024
    #33
    Dynamicpuncher likes this.
  4. catchwtboxing

    catchwtboxing Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Sure, but that is a very small point, isn't it? It doesn't really move the needle on my point.

    Bottom line is, anyone who is going to try to exiled Usyk's from cruiserweight wins is going to have to do some serious re-evaluation of their own favorite's head-to-head legacy.
     
    catchwtboxing, Dec 23, 2024
    catchwtboxing, Dec 23, 2024
    #34
  5. HistoryZero26

    HistoryZero26 Boxing Addict Full Member

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    https://boxrec.com/wiki/index.php/Buster_Mathis_vs._Claude_'Humphrey'_McBride

    In 1972 Buster Mathis and Claud Humphrey McBride competed for the Super Heavyweight belt.
     
    HistoryZero26, Dec 23, 2024
    HistoryZero26, Dec 23, 2024
    #35
    Dynamicpuncher likes this.
  6. tarrant45

    tarrant45 Active Member Full Member

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    Right so now Briedis dominates the 70s HW's also? This is getting comical now. Usyk is actually much bigger than Briedis, when you consider the shoulder width and frame, and overall thickness. Usyk did some great things but his fans need stop getting away. He had 2 close decisions vs an opponent who arguably lost to an MMA fighter in his boxing debut.
     
    tarrant45, Dec 23, 2024
    tarrant45, Dec 23, 2024
    #36
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  7. lufcrazy

    lufcrazy requiescat in pace Full Member

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    lufcrazy, Dec 23, 2024
    lufcrazy, Dec 23, 2024
    #37
  8. Redbeard7

    Redbeard7 Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Whether it "should" or not I think it does. Nobody wants or ever wanted to see a Hunter rematch at heavyweight for example, where Hunter became a top 10 fighter, stopped Bakole and drew with Povetkin.
     
    Redbeard7, Dec 26, 2024
    Redbeard7, Dec 26, 2024
    #38
    catchwtboxing likes this.
  9. bobss

    bobss New Member Full Member

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    Maybe, maybe not. This is why understanding the differences between eras need to be known by boxing scholars

    I could sit here and break the wordcount a dozen times over suggesting Usyk is the literal, single, unarguable GOAT of the sport, and I could do the same claiming he isn't worthy of lacing Ali's gloves. It's all about how you spin the facts

    imo the more suitable conversation is whether Usyk breaks into the top 20 greatest boxers of all time vs. this heavyweight discussion
     
    bobss, Dec 26, 2024
    bobss, Dec 26, 2024
    #39
  10. Serge

    Serge Ginger Dracula Staff Member

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    So truth be told Usyk became the undisputed HW champion in 15 fights given that the CWs of today are the same size as the vast vast majority of HWs back then. Sure you'd get the odd HW back then who was bigger or much bigger but likewise plenty of the HWs the greats of those eras fought wee smaller or much smaller then them. Many were LHWs and SMWs by today's standards or even MWs or LMWs on occasion

    Hell, Bill Conn weighed less than Crawford weighed for his 154 pound debut than Conn did against Louis in their first fight. Conn said he was 169, 1lb lighter than Crawford was against Madrimov so it more than evens out

    Maybe Usyk needs to drop back down to HW and fight Crawford next?

    Instead of creating a SHW division they created a CW one and kept the HW one, so Usyk gets penalised for becoming undisputed at CW even though CWs are the size of your average HW back then if not bigger

    What really happened is Usyk became undisputed HW champion in just 15 fights and then decided to dare to be great and move up to the land of giants to conquer the SHW division which should've been created instead of CW.

    And the giants of today are much more athletic, faster, more coordinated, and skilful than the handful of the plodding giant Frankenstein's monsters of back then of comparable size to them and Usyk is routinely giving away massive or obscene physical advantages to them.

    I've seen those slug slow lumbering walking statues from back then and they were slow and ponderous even when I was hitting fast forward.

    So maybe we've all got it backwards. Instead of being penalised Usyk should receive more credit for daring to move up to the land of giants to play cross the minefield against these modern day super sized monsters who are quick, skillful, athletic and coordinated and much more dangerous than both the SHW sized giants and the Terence Crawford, GGG and Caleb Plant sized HWs were from back then

    FTR, I genuinely have great respect for the old time fighters of back then but when you hurl stones at me and mine you better make sure you duck straight after doing so because they're coming right back over the fence with interest
     
    Serge, Dec 26, 2024
    Serge, Dec 26, 2024
    #40
    catchwtboxing likes this.
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