Walcott was underfed and nowhere near his best for the Abe Simon fight

I'll have to watch it now to see if there was shenanigans on the count. A quick count that is seven seconds is horrible.

Walcott also said he faded out during mid way though the count. Fighters are often full of excuses when they lose.

 

The usual referee's count takes something like 12-13 actual seconds.

In the Walcott-Marciano II fight, the referee's count lasts about 8 seconds.

I don't have much sympathy for Walcott though, he did mess up the count in the Liston-Ali rematch after all. :good

 

I think you're on to something. Walcott took at least 16 seconds to get to 10 in the Ali Liston match, so maybe 7 in his book is 10 in ours.:good

 

Walcott didn't quit in the rematch against Marciano. He blanked in the middle of the count

[yt]<object width="425" height="344"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/cBRilCUg90E&hl=en&fs=1&"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/cBRilCUg90E&hl=en&fs=1&" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="425" height="344"></embed></object>[/yt]

8:24 of the video. Open up those ears.

 

I find it very hard to get a true handle on Walcott's abilities and his prime
years.
Walcott was kod by Al Ettore in his 13th fight .Ettore was in his 61 bout.
In Walcott's 22 nd fight he was stopped by Tiger Jack Fox in 8rds .
Fox finished his career with 95 kos.
The Simon stoppage I havent seen I read that Walcott wasnt trained ,but he had fought only a month earlier beating Red Lewis by tko in 6rds .
I doubt Simon had the power to stop a motivated ,primed Walcott .In fact I find it funny when people say Walcott's chin was suspect.
Walcott met a lot of punchers,
Layne
Ray x3
Gomez
Sheppard x2
Murray
Baksi

He went 26 rounds with Louis in 2 fights,went the distance with Fox in a rematch .
Beat other decent hitters like Shkor,and Agramonte, his chin was sound .From 1940 to 48 he went without a ko loss ,and the man that finally nailed him was Louis.KO defeats to Marciano , hardly disqualify him from the durable list .
Reading between the lines , I beleive we can take Walcott's word that he was not primed ,or motivated for Simon.
Until Walcott hooked up with Bocchichio, his career lacked purpose or direction ,he was fighting just for meagre pay- days ,without ambition ,or real desire.
The fact that he still amassed such a good resume speaks volumes as to how good he could have been ,if he had the luxury of an adequate diet and steady training ,with astute managerial guidance.
He is a revelation against Louis in their first fight imo ,he looks like a million dollars ,Louis looks old ,stiff and plodding in contrast.

 

i thought walcott didn't want to get back up in the 2nd marciano fight. he quit - the way he quickly jumped up at 10 which was too late and then he retired which was a good move (or are you telling me he didn't hear the count?). the more i watch him the more i realize his defensive mistakes which would be his downfall against any ATG - look at where he holds his hands, LEFT especially in punching range when not even moving - suicidal against the best. he could move very well, was a fast puncher with a good left hook but a sucker for a fighter who sets up a good quick right hand cross - tyson v walcott would be interesting around 20 to 25 on my ATG list.

 

I think that this is the bottom line.

Walcotts sucess increased dramaticaly onece he had a good manager and was a 24/7 career boxer.

Between coming out of retirment in 1944 and meeting Joe Louis he actualy made a prety clean sweep of the ranked contenders. Here are the rankings for this period and I have highlighted the fighters that Jersey Joe beat in red. His own position is given in green while Louis is highlighted in orange because Walcott did not oficialy beat him.






1943

This content is protected

, Champion

1. This content is protected
2. Tami Mauriello
3. This content is protected
4. This content is protected
5. Gus Dorazio
6. This content is protected
7. This content is protected
8. Turkey Thompson
9. Lee Savold
10. Buddy Scott

1944

This content is protected

, Champion

1. Melio Bettina
2. Tami Mauriello
3. This content is protected
4. This content is protected
5. This content is protected
6. This content is protected
7. Jack London
8. This content is protected
9. Al Hart
10. Buddy Scott

1945

This content is protected

, Champion

1. Billy Conn
2. Tami Mauriello
3. This content is protected
4. This content is protected
5. Bruce Woodcock
6. This content is protected
7. Freddie Schott
8. Arturo Godoy
9. This content is protected
10. This content is protected

1946

This content is protected

, Champion

1. Tami Mauriello
2. This content is protected
3. This content is protected
4. Bruce Woodcock
5. This content is protected
6. This content is protected
7. Melio Bettina
8. This content is protected
9. Joe Kahut
10. This content is protected

1947

This content is protected

, Champion

1. This content is protected
2. This content is protected
3. This content is protected
4. Pat Comiskey
5. This content is protected
6. This content is protected
7. This content is protected
8. Turkey Thompson
9. Bruce Woodcock
10. Phil Muscato

1948

This content is protected

, Champion

1. This content is protected
2. This content is protected
3. Lee Savold
4. Johnny Flynn
5. This content is protected
6. This content is protected
7. Joe Kahut
8. Rusty Payne
9. Pat Valentino
10. Freddie Beshore

 

Ok lets get this straight:

1. Walcott was weakened by being starved for 5years and hadn't eaten in 48 hours? YET after being well fed for a sustained period he only weighed 2lbs more in his prime against Joe Louis. So he only put on 2lbs bodyweight going from a starved man to a well fed man? I know if I haven't eaten for 48hours I'd easily drop 4-6lbs alone nevermind being starved regularly for 5years. So this side of the story simply doesn't add up

2. Yes he may have quit and not being KO'd straight, that doesn't mean he wasn't taking punches and it doesn't mean that he didnt quit because he was taking a beating

 

:good

 

Point #1 is solid as a rock.

 

Lot's of excuses and justifications here for Walcott .. some deserved, some romanticized ... lets be real ...

The man did not enter the ring v.s. Simon starving, not having eaten in 48 hours .. that has to be extremely overstated, especially since he just fought and won weeks earlier ... his weight for the Simon fight disproves that as well ..

Let's keep in mind that Simon was a huge, strong , mauling type of guy . He hung tough with Louis the first time and took terrific punishment the second time .. my point is I can see the 250 plus Simon tiring out Walcott. Joe tended to fight in spirts and it is possible he fought a dumb fight against Simon and punched himself out ..Let's be clear, we all know Walcott was not a finisher like a Louis or a Marciano... does film exist ? IF not, how about newspaper reports ?

IT is clearly possible that Walcott's career did come together with proper management. Look what Kearns did for Dempsey. However, Walcott still lost several fights along the way with proper training and management.

AS far as his chin goes, I'd say he falls into the pretty good but not great catagory ... similiar to a Lennox Lewis or a Jack Johnson ... not glass like Wlad, not as shakey as Patterson or Ingo, not as good as the highly underated (here) Louis who had exceptional recooperative powers, and no where near the Ali's, Holmes, Marciano's ect ..

All this said I think Walcott was a GREAT fighter. A terrific combination of speed, power and skill. WE definately never saw the best he could have been due to circumstances and that is a shame. A Walcott trained consistently with the right connections from his early 20's on would have been a more consistent and dominate fighter .. since it did not happen we see shades of greatness in his patchwork career ...