Was Frazier mentally beat by Foreman?

More of 'no fight plan', and total lack of respect for 'Big George' as a
complete fighter.

Yank Durham had no pre-fight strategy, other than to let Joe go out and try
to bomb-out George in the 1st Round.

George Foreman couldn't have asked for anything better.
Not suprisingly, 'Smokin Joe' was a solid 3-1 favorite.
And, many boxing scribes felt that Foreman's #1 ranking was a joke, and that
he was nothing more than a built-up amateur, and would fold as soon as he came up
against a true professional.

Joe did land a few decent left jabs and if he employed that style early, he may have
made things interesting.

 

Frazier was a junkyard dog, fearless warrior, i don't think he was scared of Foreman, although George said his own legs were trembling before their '73 fight. Joe's legendary toughness, endurance & heart allowed him to absorb sustained brutal punishment in FOTC & Manila, but Ali was no puncher, whereas Foreman punched with the blunt-force of a mack truck.

Have you watched the '76 Foreman-Frazier II recently?
Frazier was shot after the sheer brutality of Manila, but he performed considerably better than in their first fight with his new strategy, attempting to drag Big George into deep water intead of going for an early KO, to exploit his poor stamina. Sadly, Foreman went for broke in round 5, shipping a huge payload of atomic bombs on Frazier, which eventually dropped him, then Foreman jumped on his wounded foe with vicious intent.

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joe frazier cleaned out a division and was considered a great fighter at that point. As il duce says frazier was 3-1 because he was considered 3 times beter than george at that time but this was based on the fighter frazier was up until TFOTC, since he had not been tested properly since there was no inkling as to how far away he was from being that fighter. Yank knew, thats why he picked ron stander etc and untested george foreman but he got it wrong.

Frazier was still a good fighter, but his resistance was gone and he lost perhaps one second of timing that would always cost him against a younger top contender from the next generation. remember, there is a reson why aside from foreman and bugner Frazier only fought guys like him who made their bones in the 1960s after TFOTC. He would fight anyone but his braintrust knew there was something amiss after that first ali fight.

 

Frazier was not the same after TFOC in 1971...he has said that he left everything he had in the ring that night when he beat Ali over 15 rounds...

 

Frazier thought what most did prior to their first bout. George was strong and raw,but stood no chance. The second time was after Manilla,which finished Joe. No mental issues involved.

 

If you are toying with the idea that Joe Frazier feared Foreman, you can throw the idea in the trash can.

I like an idea I read here once about the Sunshine staredown: Foreman was giving Frazier his classic killer look and Frazier stared right up at his much taller foe, bristling, champing at the bit, with a look that seemed to say, "How DARE you look at me like that?"

Foreman belted Frazier like a pure badass, but, hey, Frazier in my opinion was almost as big a badass for simply taking those bombs right on the chin, surviving and thriving even to this day.

Foreman's power was so crushing, though, that it made Frazier do funny things: Joe actually ran out of a corner --in vain-- as Foreman caught him, clipping him back to the canvas. And, of course, that "wounded flapping duck" reaction of Frazier's at the final knockdown.

The fact that Frazier sought revenge against Foreman --after the hell that was Manila-- just amazes me.

They don't come any tougher than Joe Frazier.

 

frazier did not encounter a man with foremans power when joe got hit he felt it he cringed at the punches that even missed foremans punches were thrown with intent to split a fighter into two pieces:yep:think

 

'Smokin Joe' was even slipping a bit before TFOC.
He wasn't slipping punches like he had in 1967/1968/1969/1970.

And his speed, was slower.
I still believe a 1969 Joe Frazier would have beaten Muhammad Ali even easier.
The March 1971, was not the best Joe, though the Ali posse' would disagree.

As suprisingly as this sounds, 'Smokin Joe' could have side-stepped George Foreman
in 1973, and fought Ernie Terrell (#6 Rated).

 

The joe frazier who beat ellis and bob foster would have been far too much for green george. people will say that foster and ellis were smaller but both were curent "world champions" and faster than george. frazier timed these two faster fighters before they could get into the fight. it was his timing that beat them. Frazier was pin point then.

I think foremans people took a HUGE gamble and it paid off. apart from raw power foreman still looked like a work in progress in the ted gulick fight, his last meaningful fight in the run up to his title shot. watch the gulick fight then watch frazier against foster it makes george look a rank outsider. 3-1 uderdog is generous.

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Frazier was beaten by his own style, or rather Foreman's style to his. His huge heart made it a quick job. He might have lasted longer if he ran or clinched, but mother ****ing Spartans dont run, bro.

 

Like he side stepped Ali, and, " defended" against unranked Daniels and Stander ? :rofl

 

choklab,

Could never quite figure out Ted Gullick.
The guy looked so good early in his career, and looked like he might make
some noise.
One of those guys, that could have been pretty good in a 190 lb. division.
back then.

 

Frazier wasn't mentally beat, but talking to George Foreman before the 1973 Jamaica fight would give you the impression that the challenger was. Foreman admitted that Frazier was the only fighter who ever scared him other than Norton and his ripped physique.

Frazier strongly believed that George was young and ambitious, but slow, inexperienced, and beatable like everyone else. At the time of the fight, most believed the same, and very few along with Howard Cossell predicted that Foreman would beat Frazier because of Joes deterioration after the FOTC. Futch held a different opinion in 1973, dreading what might happen against Foreman because he saw Frazier partying too much and Norton getting the better of the sparring sessions. Had Frazier fought Foreman like he did against Chuvalo by staying low, in close, working his jab and punching off the angles, he might have done a lot better. Chuvalo made Joe move backwards, but Joe smartly countered, jabbed, and side stepped George to throw his hooks. Against Foreman, Joe went straight at him, not respecting his size, power or boxing skills considering George was a heavyweight gold medalist himself. The fact that he got up 6 times is impressive and Foreman was tiring himself even after the last knockdown. In Uniondale, Frazier fought with contact lenses, practically shot, leaving everything else he had left in the tank in Manilla. He did better against George the second time, but Foreman still bombed him out.

 

Ted gullick was handing foreman his ass, his chin let him down. Frazier did not get the openings ted got because his timing was out, otherwise he might have capitalised where gullick could not. Frazier hit harder than gullick.