Was Frazier mentally beat by Foreman?

Frazier was stronger mentally than Foreman........in my opinion....
Nobody never annoyed Frazier mentally, even Ali couldn´t.......

 

Just before the 1st Knock-down in Round 1, 'Big George' hit 'Smokin Joe' with
a right hand, and you could see a 'little dance' in Joe's legs.

Joe's mental make-up changed that instant.

Suprisingly, only weeks before this bout, there were discussions of Joe Frazier defending
his title versus #5 Ernie Terrell in April 1973, in Philadelphia.

It sounds as though Joe's camp didn't think 'Big George' was that much of a risk.

 

Frazier took Foreman lightly in Jamaica. He was not in the best possible shape and never expected Foreman to come in early for a KO.
Rather stupidly Frazier did´nt change strategy during the fight - leaving a determined and controlled Forman with an easy target.

 

Ali did n't annoy Frazier mentally ????????

 

The more you look at that fight with Foreman, the more clear it is that
Joe and his camp completely under-estimated George Foreman's strength,
and if Joe took the fight to him, Foreman would collapse quickly.

Poor Ernie Terrell, in line for a nice pay-day in April 1973 vs. Frazier.
for $300,000.
His next bout, was versus Tony Doyle (who cancelled) in Philly,
for a paltry $5000.

 

Well, I mean:
Frazier fought better when somebody challenges him mentally, he was the opposite of the others Ali opponents......
Ali never could annoy Frazier at that point.....at the point to make him fear Ali......Like Ali did against Liston......

Maybe I couldn´t explain properly before, sorry........

 

Ali did try to annoy Joe,
but Joe was just as good as Ali, and Joe knew that Ali knew it.

It was 'Smokin Joe' who won the mental game in TFOC.
Ali had thought he won it, but it was Joe who pulled a reverse-mental game, and you could see at the end of the pre-fight promotion as Ali
was doubting himself.

 

Watched II yesterday. We've all heard of one fighter having another one's number, but the extent to which Foreman had Frazier's is just a head scratcher. He actually had a decent fourth round, and then George came out for the fifth like a man possessed. Short and crisp bombs that were doing damage even when they were getting blocked.

 

Ken Norton did have a perfect analysis of 'Smokin Joe'

He said Joe used to push him all over the ring, up until the end of 1971,
thats when Kenny turned the 'tide'.

 

Frazier had simply already peaked and was no longer what he once was.

Gerry cooney once said that there is but only a split second timing between a great fighter and a club fighter. You can have all the moves, conditioning but that extra timing is the edge.

I just dont see the Joe frazier of the bob foster fight losing to george foreman.

 

Chok,,,,,,,

You see the same thing I do.
'Smokin' was very quick in 67/68/69, plus he had great upper-body movement.
By 1970, he was a little thicker, and was putting more emphasis on power and less on defense and movement.
In 1971, versus Muhammad Ali, Joe was less sharp, though he dominated.

 

I agree with this. It was a short peak but frazier was a super fighter during that time..

 

This is what Joe Fraziers downfall was,,,,,,,,,

April 1970

'CHAMP FRAZIER BREAKS ANKLE IN DANCE ROUTINE'

Joe Frazier, World Heavyweight Champion, and song and dance man,
was hospitalized in Las Vegas, Nevada, with a broken ankle suffered while
performing at Caeser's Palace.

A spokesman for Joe Frazier, said the Champion suffered a fracture of the right ankle
but that the break was in a 'good position' and should heal well.

The 200 pound Frazier was appearing twice nightly with his group, The Knockouts,
at the resort hotel. Joe Frazier will do two shows nightly from a 'wheelchair'.
Dan Smyth, manager of the title holder, said Frazier, 'does a lot of vigorous dancing,
sort of twists and turns', during his performance.

The group is paid $7500 per week.

You just can't make this '****' up.

 

I believe Frazier was not afraid of Foreman, but when he was knocked down the first time he knew he was in trouble. As he stated in ' Facing Ali' film ( which by the way is an excellent film) the only mistake he did was ' to sign the contract for this fight'

 

The Frazier who fought Foster, Ellis, Chuvalo and Quarry the first time would give Foreman a much tougher fight. Not saying he wins, but his chances improve significantly if he makes it to the middle rounds.

Foreman fought the textbook fight to beat Frazier, keeping him from getting inside and with a little help from Mercante. Had Mercante did his job properly and not allowed the wrestling and shoving, I could definitely see Frazier even in the poor condition he was, landing a lot more body shots against Foreman.