Was Haye the most dangerous cruiser of all time?

Discussion in 'World Boxing Forum' started by Toney F*** U, Sep 5, 2020.


  1. CroBox29

    CroBox29 Member Full Member

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    Holyfield was way more dangerous...
     
  2. It's Ovah

    It's Ovah I am very physically burn you Full Member

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    BS. Out of their depth? A prime Haye was getting outboxed by Fragomeni and beaten up up by Mormeck. There's nothing those guys did that was better than anything Briedis or Gassiev could muster.

    My point about Wlod and Durodola is that that's how you're supposed to deal with a tough, dangerous, but ultimately limited opponent. Haye didn't do that. He got knocked out by him.

    Fair enough point with Lebedev though.
     
  3. It's Ovah

    It's Ovah I am very physically burn you Full Member

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    I'd give Haye a more than decent chance of beating all of them too, but there are no blowouts. Adamek at CW was a beast, very dangerous and skilled and Haye wasn't averse to struggling against lesser men. And all of them back to back (or near enough)? I can see him coming unstuck at some point.

    I'm not arguing that he made the wrong choice not sticking at CW. He was after the fame and the money, and the shot at Wlad, and none of that was possible staying at CW. But he never impressed at CW enough for him to be automatically favoured over even the likes of Bell (who also KOed Mormeck in a similar timeframe).

    I only use the Thompson fight as evidence that Haye wasn't this untouchable, unstoppable force. He made fatal mistakes, he gassed out, he got caught and hurt. He was vulnerable in a number of areas. Look at Huck and his first loss is 20 fights in against Steve Cunningham. Look at Cunningham and his first loss is an SD against Wlod 20 fights in. Look at Lebedev and his first loss is a disputed SD 22 fights in against Huck. None of these guys was fighting patsies up until this point, but they all kept winning regardless. Haye slipped up. And he nearly slipped up against Mock and Mormeck as well. He was dangerous but he was also reckless and headstrong, and against consistent operators I'd take the consistent guys over the glass cannons more often than not.
     
  4. expljose

    expljose Active Member Full Member

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    They took what he did again enzo and think hed do that to holyfield
     
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  5. Ra's Al-Ghul

    Ra's Al-Ghul The one and only! Full Member

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    I think Miller, Gurov and Drodz were more dangerous (maybe Tschakijew, Lebedev, Dorticos or Gassijew as well).
     
  6. madballster

    madballster Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    The Macca win was impressive for the moment in time but seen in retrospect Macca was just a glass jaw. Dozens of mediocre guys knocked him out, that puts Haye's win in perspective.
     
  7. Sugar 88

    Sugar 88 Please Sugar Don't Hurt 'Em Full Member

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    Why do you think Haye being vulnerable somehow negates how dangerous he is? He has all the skills you could want if you were looking for attributes that would allow you to upset more rounded opponents. He'd be a dangerous opponent for anyone to take on whether they beat him or not.
     
  8. Pugilist Specialist

    Pugilist Specialist Member Full Member

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    Im back from my PC garbage ban...

    Ill say that being the most dangerous cruiserweight of all time is like being the most eligible bachelor in an old folks home..
     
  9. Sugar 88

    Sugar 88 Please Sugar Don't Hurt 'Em Full Member

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    Drowning in rich widow tang? :roflmao:
     
  10. It's Ovah

    It's Ovah I am very physically burn you Full Member

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    Tacky Jew and Gassy Jew were definitely very dangerous opponents.
     
  11. lepinthehood

    lepinthehood Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    he had great speed and 1 punch power, but the dangerous ones are the ones who can outhustle you, punish you and mentally destroy ya, thats Uysk and Holyfield. Haye alot of time failed to deceive, but sure a very dangerous sniper.
     
  12. It's Ovah

    It's Ovah I am very physically burn you Full Member

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    So I guess all the heavyweights are the fat old women they prey upon?
     
  13. Serge

    Serge Ginger Dracula Staff Member

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    I like Haye and have always rated his speed and power but truth be told he came within a whisker of being sparked out by a SMW journeyman who has a KO 21% and was 0-4-1 in their last 5 fights and he was still so badly hurt after the KD he had to rugby tackle them to the canvas to buy himself more time for his head to clear.

    He went life and death against Featherfist Fragomeni and had the toad-shaped bald Italian possessed any pop he would've beaten him.

    He lost to a 40 y/o Carl ''The Cat'' Thompson who was on his 9th life. Granted it had a lot to do with him being fatigued after Thompson soaked up everything he dished out.

    He was dropped and put on spaghetti legs by Mormeck who wasn't a massive puncher

    Mormeck away is his best win at CW Level followed by either Fragomeni or Enzo then Guvor and the later two were packing big power but also big glass in their mandible sections.

    Yes Haye was a very dangerous customer indeed with that power and speed of his but I'm afraid up at CW Level his achievements are overstated and he was vulnerable.

    The mistake people are making here is the failure to grasp the fact that CW Level>>HW Level. HW Level Haye was much better than CW Level Haye because his CW Level speed and power was a nightmare for those big lumbering slug slow HW slobs.

    There's a reason why this is the most savage HL reel KO Briedis has ever scored



    Because when a CW Level fighter moves up to HW Level they're actually moving down a level

    So even though Haye achieved more at CW Level than he did down at HW Level, the Haye who fought down at HW Level was far more formidable than the one who fought up at CW Level and had he not run into one of the ATG HW greats in Wlad, who unlike 99% of HW Level fighters proved in that fight he could more than hang at both CW Level and Brit Level, he likely would've achieved a lot more down at HW Level than he did up at CW Level

    Very few HW Level fighters can hang against a CW Level fighter and many of them avoid their CW Level tests like their lives depend upon it.


    Lennox passed his CW Level test against Holyfield but it was no easy feat.

    Tyson ''The Gypsy King'' Fury passed his CW Level test against USS Cunningham but he had to go through hell on Earth to do so and there's a reason why he still to this day considers USS the hardest fight of his career.

    Sasha Povetkin did so to against Huck but again he had to go through hell on Earth and truth be told Sasha is a fat CW Level fighter.

    Look at the trail of destruction CW Level Michael ''The Bounty'' Hunter has left in his wake since making the step down to HW Level?

    Maldonado had been campaigning down at HW Level since 2002 albeit there were some huge gaps of inactivity there and no one could put a dent in him. Not Oscar Rivas, not Takam, and not Teslenko.

    Now watch what happened when he stepped up to the plate to take his CW Level test



    Behemoth Bakole is a wrecking machine who has stopped four incredibly tough HW Level fighters in back to back fights, fighters who either don't or who very rarely get stopped even though they've been thrown in with killers. Bakole gives AJ everything he can handle during the hundreds of rounds they've sparred each other



    There's a reason why Bootleg D and AJ are still to this day ducking their day of reckoning against CW Level opposition

    Because

    CW Level>>HW Level

    /thread

    Serge destroys
     
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  14. Ra's Al-Ghul

    Ra's Al-Ghul The one and only! Full Member

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    I don't know what are you one; Chrystal Meth?:dunno

    Other dangerous ones are Wassilli Shirov, Alexej Illin and Alexander Aleksejew.