Was Henry Cooper actually ahead on points vs Muhammad Ali ?

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by Dynamicpuncher, Feb 6, 2022.


  1. Dynamicpuncher

    Dynamicpuncher Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Everyone always mentions the knockdown, but the fight itself was actually very competitive. And you could make an argument that Cooper was 3-1 up in rounds.
     
  2. Richard M Murrieta

    Richard M Murrieta Now Deceased 2/4/25 Full Member

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    I do not know the judges scorecards but Muhammad Ali had no business horse playing with someone as dangerous like Henry Cooper was on June 18 1963. But do take a look at the rematch on May 21 1966, Ali as champion did avoid the left hook that Cooper did possess, Ali did slice up Henry, it was stopped in round 6 by the referee due to a rather nasty laceration on the eyebrow requiring 14 stitches, no knockdown in 1966.
     
  3. Woller

    Woller Active Member Full Member

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    According to "Boxing Illustrated" the referee had the fight even.
     
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  4. Woller

    Woller Active Member Full Member

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    Just to add this. The referee was the only man to score the fight. No judges in GB at that time. Also the referees scorecards were nearly always kept secret.
     
  5. Kosst Amojan

    Kosst Amojan Active Member banned Full Member

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    I had Cooper ahead too, similar as Jones and Petrowsky before. Also was the second fight still competitive in my view.
     
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  6. Fergy

    Fergy Walking Dead Full Member

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    Can't remember for sure, it might have been the second fight, but recall someone saying Cooper was in front at the time of stoppage.
     
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  7. Cecil

    Cecil Boxing Addict Full Member

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    The second fight was competitive.
    Cooper fought well in both fights.
     
  8. TBooze

    TBooze Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    As mentioned, only a few tops will know as the sole scorer, the ref, did not show their card unless the fight went the distance.
     
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  9. ronnyrains

    ronnyrains Active Member Full Member

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  10. LoadedGlove

    LoadedGlove Boxing Addict Full Member

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    The late, great Reg Gutteridge used to say that he'd kept his scorecards from both fights and had Ali and Cooper bang even. Reg was a very good judge and reader of a fight.
    I't's actually worth watching the rematch in 66 closely. @Richard M Murrieta and I were chatting about it recently. Henry's brains trust of Jim Wicks, Danny Holland and Henry's twin Brother, George, knew Ali would'nt fall for the "Show one, throw one" trick with the left hand again so they had Cooper feinting with the left and whipping the right over.
    Cooper never made great claims about himself but always felt he had the perfect style to beat Ali. It's a shame he never got the chance to take it all the way.
     
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  11. The Long Count

    The Long Count Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Ali should of been disqualified in the first fight. Angelo Dundee’s incompetency of administering smelling salts (at the time already banned in England but not in America) should of cost Ali the fight.
    Henry gave a good account of himself in both fights.
     
  12. LoadedGlove

    LoadedGlove Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Angelo earned his percentage that night. Cooper always said he would have expected the same of his corner.
     
  13. Journeyman92

    Journeyman92 MONZON VS HAGLER 2025 Full Member

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    Well if memory serves wasn’t Muhammad dragging it out for his predictions? In the second fight it was competitive but Ali swatted him after a bit of playing. But I might be remembering things wrong.
     
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  14. mark ant

    mark ant Canelo was never athletic Full Member

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    It was stopped on a cut.
     
  15. The Long Count

    The Long Count Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    I think Cooper was referring to the split glove legend. Where Dundee allegedly widened a small tear in Ali’s glove to give him more time between rounds. This story has mostly been debunked or at least the amount of extra time it garnered Ali. However it is quite clear on video that Ali is administered smelling salts to aid his recovery from the knockdown. Smelling Salts were banned and it made the papers the following day. Had the ref saw it- Ali likely and rightfully loses by DQ.