Was Julio Cesar Chavez "shot" at the time of his 1st fight with De La Hoya?

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by DINAMITA, Aug 3, 2008.


  1. DINAMITA

    DINAMITA Guest

    I watched the fight again for the first time in years at the weekend, and I'm interested to know what CFers think about Chavez at that fight.

    To refresh the memory:

    - Chavez's record was 96-1-1

    - The fight was at light-welterweight- where Chavez had been fighting regularly since 1989

    - He was 34 years old

    - Since suffering his first career loss to Frankie Randall in 1994, Chavez had won 7 out of 7 (5 inside the distance) leading up to the 1st DLH fight, including a points win over Giovanni Parisi, and stoppages of Meldrick Taylor, Tony Lopez, and Randall in a rematch

    - In his last fight before DLH, Chavez stopped Scott Walker (21-3-1) in the 2nd round

    - In his 3 fights following the DLH fight, he stopped Joey Gamache (45-2) in the 8th, and also beat Tony Martin and Larry LaCoursiere




    What do you think then, after looking at the facts: shot or not shot?

    (I cannot decide. I am not suggesting that this was anything remotely like a peak or prime Chavez, 80s Chavez would chew up Oscar and spit him out, but I have trouble saying he was "shot" for this fight. IMO Roy Jones Jr is shot now, Tyson was shot by the time of the Lewis fight, Sweet Pea was shot by the Trinidad fight, my idea of 'shot' is when a fighter is no longer world class anymore. I don't think Chavez was by this time)
     
  2. A Rock

    A Rock SAMUEL ETO'O!!!!! Full Member

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    i dont know about shot but definitely on the decline
     
  3. Bill Butcher

    Bill Butcher Erik`El Terrible`Morales Full Member

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    He wasnt as shot as he was for the 2nd fight but he was nothing compared to his prime yrs, a complete shell in fact.

    DLH will probably even admit this.
     
  4. Bill Butcher

    Bill Butcher Erik`El Terrible`Morales Full Member

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    I also think DLH was a level above the guys JCC had been fighting in his previous fights (were he didnt look that good IMO) aswell as being naturally bigger than Chavez.
    DLH was bigger, faster, younger & likely hit harder... in other words, the completely wrong opponent for a 34 yr old legend in severe decline.

    Despite the size advantage, I think prime Chavez outpoints DLH.
     
  5. Loewe

    Loewe internet hero Full Member

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    I don´t think he was shot but ver much past his prime. He still was able top beat mediocre ot average opposition but somebody like DLH was just too good at that time of his career.
     
  6. zadfrak

    zadfrak Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    Yes.

    But that doesn't give him a go directly to go and collect $200 card. It was just a case of the shoe being on the other foot, is all. Chavez built his record when he was the guy with youth and reflexes fighting the older guy on the other side of the mountain. The DLH fight was a role reversal and time to see how he would do against against pedigreed youth.
     
  7. TBooze

    TBooze Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    He was a disgrace that night.

    I always liked Chavez, and always will, but that night he let himself down and cost his fans a fortune, purely so he could make some money.

    To go into a borderline superfight knowing a few days back you had been busted opening in sparring is way over the line IMO.
     
    alangjk likes this.
  8. teeto

    teeto Obsessed with Boxing banned

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    I would say he was shot personally. To me he never looked the same at 140 as what he was at the lower weights. He was young and hungry, and a force of nature at 130, seemed to be at his best at 135, matured yet still hungry. And then imol wasnt the same again at 140, but still had a desire to emerge victoriious.
     
  9. redrooster

    redrooster Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    after 100 fights what do you expect. Yes it was apparant to anyone who'd seen him he had mileage and was just holding on for some crumbs to be thrown his way. Soft, round, over the hill, a steppingstone to be sure
     
  10. SuzieQ49

    SuzieQ49 The Manager Full Member

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    no chavez wasnt shot, he had just beaten a slew of top 10 guys heading into the oscar fight and his record was 96-1.


    lol in your dreams, chavez always would never have beaten oscar. oscar had too much boxing skills for chavez, too stiff of a jab, too much sharp fast combos for chavez to deal with.
     
  11. Holmes' Jab

    Holmes' Jab Master Jabber Full Member

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    On the downslope, but not totally shot.
     
  12. Holmes' Jab

    Holmes' Jab Master Jabber Full Member

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    Lets be realistic here I think he'd outhussle De La Hoya and get the decision. The only real time a close to peak Chavez was outclassed was against Whitaker (unfortunately the judges failed to see the same) who was without question a much better fighter than DLH (that's no slight on Oscar by the way).
     
  13. DINAMITA

    DINAMITA Guest

    I am a big DLH fan, but IMO Chavez is a level above him. I have Chavez far higher than Oscar in all-time p4p terms, and I'd back him to beat the Golden Boy at any weight below welter.
     
  14. Hatesrats

    Hatesrats "I'm NOT Suprised..." Full Member

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    Not shot, but very under prepared.
    Chavez Vs. De La Hoya II is the proof.
    Julio was able to hang with Oscar and at times hit him with
    shot's that would have hurt an average 140Lbs'er, but this fight
    was way out of Chavez BEST, and Oscar was no normal 147.
    Welterweight was defo a weightclass that Chavez should have avoided.
    On fight night Chavez was 144Lbs & De La Hoya was 160Lbs.
    4 years after their first fight, And Chavez gave a better account.
    (But by then, Oscar was in unbeatable mode & Life had caught up to Chavez)
     
  15. martin0792

    martin0792 The Golden Boy Full Member

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    The first fight Oscar De La Hoya boxed to a set plan, clearly to use his height and reach advantages. Oscar was never accepted by Mexican fans because he destroyed their Champion in 4 rounds, They told him he was afraid of trading with Chavez and he was not a great fighter, Mexican Fans wanted blood and guts, Chavez bled for them. Oscar was angered by this so in the rematch he stood and traded with Chavez, forcing him to submit in the later rounds, Mexico had finally accepted Oscar De La Hoya.