Was Roy Jones a great defensive fighter?

Definitely one of the best defensive fighters and had the best reflexes i have ever possibly seen in a boxer,he is up there with the Whitaker and Floyd because of his reflexes which meant he hardly got hit.

 

Shavers wasn't missing because Ali was anything near a defensive technician, Bokaj. Ali was clinching all over the joint. That takes some level of skill, but it is not as impressive as making a man miss by an inch as you slide inside and counter at the same time time.

Ali took it to the body like no one else. He was also leaning back on the ropes and holding him.

If you are impressed with Ali's technical wizardry in Zaire, then we are on different planets. Technically, Ali was not impressive in Zaire. Tactically he sure was, but let's call it what it is.

It was a great victory, but it was not a Pep-like display by any stretch of the imagination.

I'd also consider Ali's ability to take it downstairs as a key to that victory.

Frazier gave him a real beating as early as '71.

Eh. He "kept his right up" and "leaned on Frazier"...? I have a higher standard than you do in terms of what constitutes a defensive technician.

 

1. RJJ
2. SRR
3. Willie Pep
4. Sweet Pee
5. PBF

 

You have obviously never seen Niccolino Locche, he is breathtaking to watch on the ropes.

There are three main types of defence: head movement, foot movement and hand movement. All three are equally important in the defensive aspect of boxing, but for me to be described as a true defensive wizard you need to have technically mastered at least two of these skills to the highest standard. Willie Pep had breathtaking head and foot movement, whereas Wilfred Benitez utilised all three, and again Niccolino Locche preferred head and hand movement.

However, Roy Jones Jr and Muhammed Ali were nearly as hard to hit as these master’s but I would not name them among the defensive geniuses of Boxing. These men had physical skills in abundance, the type of physicality’s us mortals can only imagine having. They were quick, had great reflexes and were superb judges of timing and distance. There physical skills fell into the realms of foot and head movement as they slipped, stepped and circled away from punches, but they had not mastered these skills technically they made ‘technical’ mistakes, for example Ali pulled back straight from a punch and Jones had quite a wide stance. They had good defence but definitely not great. They could not counter-punch as skilfully as Willie Pep or Niccolino Locche nor could they get out of a corner as skilfully as Wilfredo Benitez.


Now take someone like Hilario Zapata a great all-round defensive fighter. He utilised all three aspects of defence and was technically sound. He was much harder to hit than Ali or Jones despite not having the same physical gifts, he definitely had great timing, reflexes etc... Just not to the high levels of Jones and Ali. Zapata however was more technically solid, in a defensive standpoint; he was much more versatile and could make a man miss in many ways and then come back in a variety of ways. His makes him to me a defensive wizard.

Just out of interest my top defensive boxers are

• Niccolino Locche
• Willie Pep
• Miguel Canto
• Hilario Zapata
• Wilfredo Benitez

 

No. He was blessed with some of the best reflexes ever. That was his defense.So technicaly no.

 

Regarding this logical point any boxer could be p4p best defensive fighter cause even ******s can hide behind a guard shell.

 

No - you didn't place that sentence in the proper context.

Those are a matter of great technique, and to a degree courage (since they could've also stayed safe on the outside). It makes a great defensive fighter. But the reverse need not be true: a great defensive fighter doesn't have to do Toney-esque stuff on the inside.

 

You're probably the only person who'd consider Robinson one of the best defensive fighters ever. He showed very good defense when he wanted, don't get me wrong, but his offense was his defense most of the time.

 

Ok let's deny footwork and head-movement here.

 

I think Zapata had some pretty awesome physical gifts, actually Pater. I don't think anyone was "much harder to hit" than a prime Roy Jones, either. Whether you think he had great technical skills or not, there are very few fighters you can name that were hit less often than Jones.

 

Not its not always safe on the outside. Can you imagine Toney being as great defensively and countering like Jones could operating from the outside? Hell no.

 

He had magnificent footwork, but footwork in itself doesn't necessarily constitute great defense. He was too offensive minded to be a great defensive fighter, and lacked the head movement and anticipation of punches that someone like Duran had. Again, he did everything well, but his defense fell short of great IMO. I actually don't think his head movement was particularly standout.

 

Look Roy Jones had to be good defensively by position. A fighter that operates from the outside and falls in with counter shots and power leads has to end up in a position where he can either slip or not be hit. Jones did a lot of that. If thats not part of defense I dont know what is. If you want to classify defense as standing in front of your opponent and making them miss that wouldnt be the full spectrum of defense either.