Was Roy Jones overrated?

Yes.

I actually loved that fight.

Kell gave it his all against a guy he should never have dreamt of fighting, and GG just waved him forward before dissecting him.

I've never been a huge fan of Kell's, but he deserves enormous respect for fighting GG, before then dropping back for Spence. He really earned my respect for those 2 performances. I'm a much bigger fan of his now.

I'm also a fan of GG's. But we've got to be real here. Anybody who says that he has a better defence than a peak version of Roy, is clearly out of their mind on class A drugs.

 

lol, yes he is far easier to hit Golovkin. I feel sorry for Kell tbh. I would love to be behind the scenes on that deal going down with GGG. A good team wouldn't of allowed it, perhaps they tried and he had the last word obviously, but if that was anyone close to me, or if I was his trainer I genuinely would've said "don't do this". Fight whoever the **** you want at 147 even try 154, but dont jump up to 160 against a champ that 100% will iron you out, with no obvious chances. Its not like GGG is a boxer that would just ud him, he was always gonna hurt him. I'm quite a fan of Brooks myself, I think he was maybe the best 147 guy before he fought GGG

 

like you are a glass jawed alt of a jones hater.

aye, bro.

 

As an admirer of RJJ it's hard for me to say it was all weight loss that caused him to lose to Tarver or anyone else after that. I think of how Lebron James bulked up, then dropped a LOT of weight, then put it back on. Some say Lebron lost fat, but look.... he was never a Charles Barkley body to boot. He was still muscular before and after. And won a title after his 67 day drop in weight. Other athletes have dropped muscle mass, but didn't bomb out like RJJ.

And I also question if/why Mackie Shilestone a (conditioning) coach was used to gain weight, but not dropping down. What better means to ensure your conditioning is adequate when dropping back down?

Losing muscle mass has what to do with defense? RJJ never shoulder rolled, used angles, glued that left hand to his chin. He did so much stuff wrong in his youth, just like Ali/Clay would back straight out. a No-No, but that don't matter when one has super-freak reflexes.

RJJ could loop his punches, but it didn't matter, they were so quick they looked textbook straight. Think of the shot from behind the back. Nothing straight. BUT, it hit its mark because of RJJ's talent.

At the time he dropped in weight, Tarver had a game plan, greater reach than Roy's previous foes & 2 1/2 inch height advantage that RJJ had never dealt with previously.

And Glen Johnson was a nonstop workhorse who would hit anything from bell to bell. From round one on, just look at RJJ's game plan. 2:50 seconds left Round 1---his Back against the ropes. 2:38 seconds he Backs away to another set of ropes- keeps his back against them. Then repeat. My point: he didn't lean against the ropes to get some air or to buy time. That was his gameplan 10 seconds in to the fight! One example- round 4 Compubox said RJJ landed 4 shots. It's only round 4. Is that the result of muscle loss or the result of a fighter whose game plan of pot-shot counter punching got compromised? Just look at punch stats against Calzaghe, he threw more in that fight then his fights before moving to HW.

Probably because he was forced to against Joe the energizer bunny. In other words, given the chance Roy would prefer to win landing single digits per round 8 or 9 to his foe landing 3-5 punches per round.
How does one lose muscle mass post HW, yet throw more punches in his fights post HW, then pre HW?

RJJ's greatest asset IMO was never skill. Same with Ali & to some extent Pernell. They relied on talent. When father time came knocking they had nothing to substitute the loss of youth. So without moving UP to HW, RJJ days would've been numbered either way.

Doesn't change how he won the MW, SMW & LHW titles at all. Doesn't diminish his standing as the fastest mofo of his era.

 

I think it all happened in a rush.

I honestly believe Hearn when he said that Eubank Snr scuppered the fight for Jr by insisting on various last minute demands. People have criticised Jr for losing his pen etc, but I firmly believe that Jr would have taken that fight.

I also think that Brook jumped at the opportunity because he'd been frustrated by criticism of his resume. Maybe Dominic Ingle thought he had everything to gain and nothing to lose.

Believe it or not, I think the decision to drop back to WW for Spence was a bigger mistake than taking the GG fight.

 

I watched that mate, about 3 months ago.

I absolutely loved it.

Marjorie Diehl.

What a woman. I was fascinated by her.

 

Mackie tried his best to talk Roy out of dropping back to fight Tarver, but to no avail.

He told of him of the probable consequences.

Some fighters like Hearns dropped weight and were successful, but Tarver, Byrd and Dawson all suffered the same fate as Roy.

Mackie has said many times since that losing muscle fast at an advanced age can have a detrimental affect on the body.

Roy had fought 50 times across weight 5 weight classes, and was 35 when he lost to Tarver. His unorthadox style was based around split second timing. The weight loss affected his punch resistance, his age affected his reflexes, and the knockouts killed his confidence and destroyed his aura of invincibility.

Johnson knew he had a diminished version of Roy in front of him who'd been shell shocked by Tarver.

After those losses, Roy never won another fight at the highest level. He became a gun shy fighter who became hesitant, second guessing himself.

 

Not sure If I forgot Mackie told him , or never knew. Either way, damn good response. Agree with all except the weight loss affected his punch resistance, since he was known to make people miss so often, we can't really name too many flush punches he took. And I can't use the Lou Devalle KD as an example- because I site that he got hit at the same time he landed/slipped in a puddle/pool of his corner's water they drenched him with!
And he did get up on steady legs!

 

I agree. Hearn is blatantly telling the truth on Eubank Snr too, ive seen it on ifl's video of Snr saying "the first penny needs to drop in to Jnr's pocket" and Barry McGuigan has to commentate etc...Funny as **** if you don't have to deal with him, but mental all the same, It was a clear duck at the last minute from Team Eubank, the money was to good for any other explanation

 

Yeah, but I'm sure Jnr would have fought him. People can criticise him, but he's got some heart. I think he'd have given GG a tough fight too.

Snr obviously misses being out of the spotlight and his ego wanted control over everything.

 

The shot that Tarver landed was a beautiful shot. I think that would have knocked Roy out at any point in his career. But the shot that Johnson hit him with left him cold, despite it not looking like a huge shot. According to Roy and his team, the ringside doctor said he was completely dehydrated. Whatever happened, that was the end of his career right there.

Look at what happened to Byrd against Shaun George. Byrd had taken decent shots from great HW's, yet George beat him with ease.

Mackie says that losing muscle can affect your immune system:

http://www.boxingtalk.com/pag/article.php?aid=15849

 

Depends on what you mean by overrated. Was Mayweather Jr overrated? Is Lomachenko? Your answer, for consistency's sake, should probably be the same for all three questions.