was this fight ever filmed???

Without calling into question anyones character Id have to see it to believe it. Ive heard claims for years of various clips of the different LaMotta-Robinson fights and they ALWAYS without fail turn out to be alternate versions of the sixth fight. Im on friendly terms with most of the major film collectors in the US and some abroad and I have to feel that with the money these guys are willing to offer and the reputations they have if such a film were available it would have surfaced.

On a side note, for what its worth, Steve Lott is one of the nicest gentlemen in boxing and its a shame some on here have chosen to disparage him.

That being said I also understand where raging bull is coming from on not just letting anyone see his stuff. Since when is he obligated to show anything from his collection to anyone? Do you honestly think there arent masterpieces of art or antiquities in private collections all over the world that have never and may never be seen by the eyes of the general public? Those things you could even publish a photo of or a copy of and it wouldnt greatly diminish its valuable. With a boxing film the viewing experience is the value, owning the film is meaningless and a copy even less than that. I understand people being angry that they cant view these things but some of us work extremely hard and spend lots of money and time finding this stuff and once its been traded all over creation where the quality is watered down to **** or anyone can have a copy simply by pressing the click of a button it really invalidates a lot of the hard work that went into finding and acquiring this stuff. My only suggestion is to start looking and preserving this stuff on your own then you have a bargaining chip for further trades, you will also understand where collectors are coming from.

Now, I have an exhibition between Jimmy Wilde and Joe Lynch from 1919 that I need to work on getting...

 

...

 

First off Steve Lott didnt own Cayton and Jacobs collection so if Famechon's belt was in that collection it wasnt up to him to decide whether it went to anyone. Lott didnt sell the collection to anyone and he didnt sell the belt to Arnold. He may have handled the sale for Cayton's estate but it wouldnt have been his to give to anyone.

Furthermore, the Cayton-Jacobs collection was not even catalogued until after it was sold to ESPN. Your talking about tens of thousands of fights. As such Lott has little if any control over who gets what and when and may not have even known where to begin looking for a Griffo fight even IF it was in the collection. What people dont understand is that ESPN makes almost no money from the airing of those old fights. However, they can make money off of licensing the rights for people who dont own the films to use them in things like documentaries, tv shows, etc. Therefore dont you think Lott could get himself in some serious legal hot water by just giving that film to Arnold or anyone else? So hes supposed to put himself at risk, basically steal someone elses property, just because you want to watch it... for free? Isnt that why they SELL tickets to boxing events and dont just admit the public for free? As I recall these old films were filmed specifically with idea of making a profit. Am I wrong? They werent filmed so that the whole world could be charitably allowed to see them. They were in fact, the first films to actually make profits. Unfortunately they havent diminished in value over time and as such those who want to see them still have to pay for the privilege.

 

It is an interesting debate and I can see both sides of the the argument. It is a shame that these films are not shared with a wider audience, but I can understand that if a great deal of time and effort was invested in the procuring of these films then I can understand the reticence of people to uploading it to YouTube for any Tom Dick or Harry to see.

I suppose the people to sort this out would be guys like ESPN who could actually make some money by licencing some the rare footage that they must have, to documentary/film makers instead of showing us an endless loop of the same fights week in week out.

 

klompton,

Thank you for chiming in, of all the people here you are the one who I know beyond a shadow of a doubt understands my position here, even if we bumped heads in the past and have differing opinions of Steve Lott. And for the other posters who stepped in to defend me, thank you as well fellas.

And believe me when I tell you that this brief HL I mentioned in this thread is indeed from their 5th encounter, this is NOT a alternate angle of the 6th fight I can assure you and anyone else, this footage is from the same source I had told you about months ago and who I`ve known for years.

I`m still working very hard on trying to get those Gavilan/SRR films, and maybe one day when I get the full fights of some of the fights I am currently pursuing, maybe then I`ll share some brief snippets of footage with the rest of the world for all to see.

But folks need to understand that when someone spends as much time and money on acquiring rare footage as I do, when the day finally comes that I have something in my possession that I worked so long and hard to acquire my first instinct isn`t to share it with the world but rather to treasure it and keep it for myself.

Why should I share something that I went thru considerable trouble and expense to get a hold of with the whole world? No one here would do the same I can guarantee it, not when you cough up big bucks to get a hold of it, your gonna want to keep that for yourself for some time at the very least before you even contemplate sharing something so expensive and valuable.

And again, somtimes you are given something rare by a fellow collector and if they ask you to keep it to yourself than you have to do so as you are bound by your word once you accept the footage under those conditions. Why betray a friend and possibly compromise a mutually beneficial partnership by betraying the other party`s trust? This makes no sense and none of you guys would do such a thing if put in the same position.

 

speaking about boxing dvds have you sent mine out yet

 

Yes, they went out earlier this week, look for them to arrive sometime next week around Thursday.

 

Out of curiosity Raging Bull. how much money are we talking for some of these films? ball park figure, in the $100's?

 

ok thanks mate