Was Usyk Unbeatable At Cruiserweight ?

You can go all the way to 200 for the old heavyweights not even factoring in dehydration factors. Pretty sure Usyk fought at 200 after it was changed from 190 years back.

 

I'm sorry, but I don't see anything special in Usyk. Even at cruiserweight. In my opinion, he's simply the best in a below average era of boxers in the cruiserweight/ heavyweight division .
Is he that much better than DeLeon, Occasio, or Hill? In my opinion no he isn't. It's simply he's come along in an era where today's contenders wouldn't have been ranked in the top ten 30-50 years ago, today's champs would only be contenders 30-50 yrs ago.
Just as I've said on this site well before Lomo's loss to his 1st serious challenge, and well before Wilders 1st loss. I see a lot of big holes in Usyks fight game, and the reasons for his success is more about the level of his competition than anything extraordinary that he does.
So yeah, he is unbeatable at cruiserweight. But only in his own era.

 

Excellent post. I can see the above names going down to cruiser and beating Usyk...... except Liston. I see a HW Liston beating any Usyk but I genuinely don't know how much of his power he would retain at cruiser.

Then again, it's possible he wouldn't necessarily need his power given his other abilities. Many here think Liston was this one-dimensional puncher but that's anything but true. Janitor nailed it with an excellent post here.

 

Is there a single boxer you rate in the last three decades Flash?

Love ya man but come on.

 

Usyk never fought at 190 as a pro. He never came close.

Usyk weighed at 201 pounds at the Olympics.

And Usyk was never able to dry out as low as 198 as a pro.

Not once, even with weigh-ins 30 hours before the fight. He couldn't get to 198. He was always a little or a lot more.

I don't know why people don't acknowledge that.

Usyk fought in the same division as an amateur as Mike Tyson, Deontay Wilder, Tommy Morrison, Ray Mercer, etc.

Match him with the great heavyweights in history who fought around 200 to 220.

Not middleweights like Toney who moved up.

It's like if they raised the welterweight limit to 157 and a guy who fought in the Olympics at 156 and never weighed less than that as a pro (even with weigh-ins 30 hours before the fight) was held up as the best welterweight ever, when he couldn't have made 147 if his life depended on it.

 

A Lewis, Wlad and Fury sparring partner, American amateur standout and 42 pro fight veteran stated that Usyk was the most skilled boxer he’d ever shared a ring with.

Usyk is considerably bigger than same day weigh in 190 pounder Holyfield and more experienced prime for prime at cruiser. Holyfield's record against southpaws was poor, he's said that he struggled with them. Holyfield, a highly egoistical fighter, even admitted that Usyk would beat him "in this era" and that Usyk's boxing style would be very difficult, he preferred fighters to come at him.

In a hypothetical neutral fight Usyk wouldn't be on the road and Holyfield wouldn't be at home, which they virtually always were in their title fights. That further favours Usyk.

Okolie is very difficult to beat with home/A-side advantage, every fight looks like Wlad-Povetkin. But we have to suspect that he's not as good as Joshua.

Haye might have a punchers chance but he'd be a clear underdog.

Briedis came the closest to beating Usyk but he had home advantage and still lost 7-5 by consensus.

No one is unbeatable (there are too many ways to lose a fight) but I don't think any cruiser would be favoured to beat Usyk.

 

Here's how great he is ... for all his big mouth , Fury is pricing himself out because he hs his own doubts ... I am on the record stating if they fight Usyk dices him up , way too fast and active ... Fury will not be able to win with his 200 punches per fight and your fat all over the guy .. Usyk is too quick and too smart ..

 

I think Toney beats him though.Usyk had lots of trouble with Bellew

 

Very good, except Liston should very easily make CW.
Rule of thumb is that guys can cut @ 10% off there weight to re-hydrate in 24 hours.
Those who can do on the high end? Carrying more muscle, as opposed to someone tall & lean for their division.
Thus Liston who weighed no more than 210-215 lbs. at his peak-he could easily retain likely all his power below 200 lbs.

I actually do not know how Liston did not weigh more-although not tall, at his bone structure & apparent muscle-& not "no legs" like a Hearns or Wilder-AND not looking very low body fat at all, I dunno why his actual weight was not ~ 230 lbs.

Which is what first career/peak Foreman would have weighed without dehydration.
Now HE is a great example for someone, already lean & relatively dried out at late 2 teens or so, who would lose strength & muscle weighing in at CW.

 

This is exactly as I see it.
Usyk did not have a superb amateur record of 350 + fights for nothing.
His workrate, southpaw...Everything but Epic power, which he does not need.
Tons of competition, better talent P4P generally at CW, & larger than CW Holyfield.

I am puzzled that given the global talent pool, & at least when we compensate for the fact that divisions are de facto larger than the past, some believe that this era is weaker or even much weaker than other ones.

 

That's an interesting question on it's own.
I think it was the most competitive period in the Cruiserweight division's history - because of WBSS - but was it really more rich in talent than when Juan Carlos Gomez, Johnny Nelson, Vassiliy Jirov and Fabrice Tiozzo held titles? With Toney, Marcelo Dominguez, Carl Thompson among contenders.

I'm not sure, but I definitely agree that Usyk cleaned out very strong division. We had quite a few undisputed champions in last couple years and I think Usyk's run was clearly the most impressive - over Inoue's at 118, Jermell's at 154, Crawford's and Taylor's at 140.

 

Why would he need to dry out to 198lbs? Contests he fought were contested at 200lbs. He may well have been able to make 198lbs if required, but I don't see the relevance.

He's ranked as a top 2 CW based on fights contests in the CW division. People, in the main, aren't saying he beats everyone in history who weighed between 200-220lbs.

 

He lost a few rounds to Bellow but still knocked him out. It's not like he lost to Drake Thadzi...

 

Sorry JT. But I don't see it. This era of boxing fans seem to want to give a fighter the status of greatness if they win a few fights consecutively, much more weight is placed on an "undeafeated record" than who that "undeafeated record was against. MY "old school " mentality is let him earn it.
Usyk has 20 total fights , the last 4 at heavyweight, meaning some are considering him "unbeatable " with 16 total fights at cruiserweight? Against opponents that some are considering good, but I see as average, at best.
Usyk makes plenty of mistakes that fighters the level of Occasio, or Hill would've taken advantage of, especially fighters the level of Qawi or Holyfield .
So he throws a lot of punches.... So does most amateurs the problem is the opponents he's faced simply do not have the skill level to counter it. Nothing that special about what he does.
I was proven right about Joshua, Lomo, and Wilder .
At 36 yrs old fighting once a year if that, I'll be proven right about Usyk.
He isn't a great heavyweight, and at the rate he's fighting will never be. Wasn't a great cruiserweight, he just came along at a time his opponents were simply much worse.