were the 80s middleweights the best?

40's & 60's blow it away. 90's were better, too, at least the first half of the decade.

 

And a guy named Toney.

And a guy named McClellan.

And a guy named Jackson.

And a guy named McCallum.

And another couple blokes named Eubank and Benn, though they moved to super-middle.

And some great 2nd tier guys in Collins, Parks, Reggie Johnson, John David Jackson, Jorge Castro, Quincy Taylor, Thomas Tate, Kalambay and even Duran deserves a mention here.

 

You serious rr ?
Just compare my era of the 1930s with Ken Overlin, Freddie Steele, Marcel Thil, Tony Zale, Billy Conn, Fred Apostoli, Teddy Yarosz, Solly Krieger,
Al Hostak, Georgie Abrams, Jock McAvoy, Len Harvey,Fred Hennenberry, etc. What a powerful roster of great middleweights in the 1930 era..WOW..

 

:dealThis. End thread

I would add the 40s too

 

Out of those 13 names how many do you think the 80's Hagler would beat Burt? How many wins vs losses out of 13 fights.

 

This represents probably the greatest inherent advantage you have over other posters Burt, the fact you're intimately familiar with both eras.

I do think the 1980s provided a far more formidable crop of middleweights though than Hagler's dominance of the division commonly allows general credit for. Guys like Dwight Davison, Frank Fletcher, James "Hard Rock" Green, Curtis Parker and Bobby Czyz couldn't even get to Hagler through the jungle of other contenders.

Create a list of the best middleweights not to get a shot at Hagler during Marv's reign, and an impressive list can be generated.

Of course the 80s middleweights were certainly televised to best advantage, but in addition to Burt's abridged 1930s "Rogue's Gallery," let's not forget the then obscure WW II era "Murderer's Row" MW lineup in California alone, among a vast assortment of obscenely active, talented and experienced competitors by modern standards. (I suspect an awful lot of posters here are just eagerly waiting with baited breath for Stoney to spot this thread and thunder in here with his lead and titanium bludgeon about Ezz, Arch, Lloyd, Booker, CK, Wade, Burley, Chase, Holman, and friends. Let's also not forget that the likes of Kid Matthews competed at 160 throughout the 1940s.)

With the 1980's advent of cable sports programming like ESPN's Top Rank Boxing, even club fighters enjoyed wide exposure and followings not experienced by lesser tier performers with such large audiences of witnessed performances at other points in boxing history. Give the gangs from the 1930s and 1940s the same television technology, widespread viewership from throughout the land, and preservation of such broadcast action, and the 1980s might finish a distant third to the 1930s and 1940s eras of the "Greatest Generation," although individual champions like Greb, Hagler, Walker and Fitz would always stand out apart from the 30s and 40s. (RR was certainly on top with his mention of the 1940s, and it's a good question to challenge and inform younger posters about comparable eras.)

 

I doubt you will find many who agree with your opinions but you are free to hold them.

The 80's and 90's were my era closest to the sport, met many of the people you write about. You are selling guys like McCallum (who nobody wanted to fight) and Jackson (his power is at the most elite level the sport has witnessed) very short. McClellan was an animal, too.

And there is no way in hell that Sibbo would stand a chance against McCallum, who had very respectable pop and tore guys apart to the body. MCallum had first rate boxing skills, a great chin, and good pop. Like I said, no one wanted to fight him, and he was largely avoided until he got older.

 

We are talking about the best total crop of MWts. Hagler stood above his contemporaries,and the guys of my era were packed with more talent over all than Haglers opponents. Were Hagler to have fought in the 1930s, facing such a powerful field of middleweights,who fought much more often
in the 1930s, I'm convinced he would suffer a few defeats.
Freddie Steele was almost unbeaten for 10 years,until a painful breastbone fracture,was only one of a truly great field of American and European 160 lb
Champions and contenders...Marcel Thil was probably France's greatest fighters. A more rugged edition of Marcel Cerdan. Al Hostak was a tremendous puncher those days, alongst Tony Zale and the rugged Fred Apostoli...Georgie Abrams who drew with Charley Burley,and gave Ray Robinson HELL, along with the two great classy boxers, Teddy Yarosz,and Billy Soose, were champs in the 1930s. Britain had 2 great punching MWs Jock McAvoy, and Len Harvey at their peaks then. Rugged Ken Overlin who
beat the rampaging Ezzard Charles and Australia's tough and aggressive Fred Henneberry, were in that tough middleweight mix in the great 1930 era who would all be a threat to Marvin Hagler in my opinion....

 

The 1910s- Harry Greb, Sam Langford, Stanley Ketchel (though only for a short time), Mike Gibbons, Les Darcy, Jack Dillon, Frank Klaus, Billy Papke, Jimmy Clabby, Eddie McGoorty, Jeff Smith, Mike O'Dowd, George Chip.....

A pretty stacked era. The 1930s and 40s trump the 80s as well, imho. Just look at the names.

 

I think that Hags could beat the majority of them on a given night. Several might have taken him as well. They would have had plenty of opportunities too cuz if he was fighting back then he would have fought each man several times. Times were rougher back then as I'm sure you're aware:good

 

Loving your work Red!


How could anyone mention Toney in the same breath as Hamsho, Davison, Sibson, Roldan, Hearns, Scypion, Obel, Nunn, Kalambay, Leonard and Tony Ayala and Frank Le Animarl Fletcher. Heck, James Green would have been even money with him. He probably would have sat around the Mark Holmes and Alex Ramos level i reckon in that era.

Their power wouldn't have stood out, for sure. They would have sat a full level below Don Lee, Dwight Davison and Sibbo for power alone.

I could just picture the classy Sibbo schooling peak McCallum too. His vaunted body attack would have been rendered useless by Sibbo's generous midriff.

 

So that's about a dozen that would have a realistic chance of beating him.