What 3 Old Timers would give......

What d'you mean old timers? How long does it have to be since they last fought?

 

Seems like mostly turn of the century fighters?

 

I think the better fighters of their time would present the most problem in this time.

Jack Johnson's biggest change would be that he would have to accelerate his work rate, combine more of an offensive attack to the defense, and gear himself to a twelve round fight as opposed to a longer contest and take more chances. But he had the athletic skill, speed, and most important, intelligence, to be dangerous at any time.

Jim Corbett. Corbett would benefit a great deal from more modern nutrition and advances made in athletic development. But the raw material, mental and physical, is all there. Fast, clever, like Johnson, enjoyed it when he made the other guy miss and look the fool. Corbett would never be huge, but I see him as a pretty natural 205lb guy (who goes on to fight bigger, at say, 215) who wins at cruiser and then moves up to outpoint a lot of guys at heavy.

Jim Jeffries, the natural athletic ability is all right there. Like Tyson, this is a guy who was fully athletically formed from a real young age. Just, bam, he is ready to go by the age of 18. Jeffries main attribute was strength and stamina, in addition to his athletic ability. I would say that the lack of a long lasting fight, might hurt Jeffries a little, but, then the guys whom he'd be fighting would be right in front of him. If he can take the punch (and he was a lot easier to hit than Jim or Jack), I imagine a much more formidable George Chuvalo type of guy. And could be real big trouble.

Funny thing is, I don't see any of these cats fighting had they been born 25 years ago. Jeffries would be gobbled up by his high school football coach and might have Brian Urlachers job. Corbett would probably have been born an hours drive from the nearest boxing gym (is there still a gym of any kind in Frisco?) and may have had a career in finance or, if athletically minded, baseball, like his brother did.

Even such a natural fighter like Johnson would probably not have pursued boxing as a way of living. Maybe music or something else. Johnson, like Corbett, not so much Jeffries, was always the kind of guy who was going to be someone. He probably would have found some way outside of the ring.

but times change, even if people really don't. In thirty years, the top ten heavyweights could be mostly Cuban. Product of the times, then and now.

 

Out of those guys i would pick Johnson, the man was immense

 

Harry Greb.

Although it's impossible to get a solid, quantitative examination of his ability as a fighter, his resume makes it clear that he was truly exceptional.

By all accounts, he had legendary durability, stamina, and workrate, and was supposedly very dirty, but yet in a way that actually might not harm him too much under modern rules (unlike, say, Jack Johnson, who would be quickly DQ'd in a match under modern rules).

His resume against greats of his era is outstanding. Although he wasn't filmed, many of these other greats were, and his opponents do not seem bad, certainly not bad enough to allow a mediocre fighter to run right through them.

I have deep-seated doubts about most men who fought prior to the ~1930s performing well in the modern era. I have no such doubts about Greb, though.

 

I do not think Corbett was big enough, or hit hard enough to beat the best modern supper heavies. However, I think Gentleman Jim could be an all time cruiserweight or a pound for pound ATG at light heavy.

Johnson to me was not active enough in terms of throwing punches, was too passive, and clinched too much to succeed in a modern era of boxing. He also had a shaky chin, but we hardly saw it because he clinched 2/3 of the round, and really was not in there vs quality prime fighters ( Guys who could be champion today ) on flim.

I think Jeffries ould take to modern training like a fish takes to water. Jeffries was a top notch athelte who was big enough, hit hard enough, and had the punch to succeed in modern boxing.

Pre Marciano, the old timers I think would do the best today are:

Jeffries, Dempsey, and Louis. I do think Dempsey and Louis would need to be 210-215, and probably could reach this weight with modern training / nutrition.

 

None of them would stand a chance in the heavy ranks of today.

But you seem to like this line of fantasy play, so carry on...

 

I try not to pigeonhole a fighter if he fought 75-100 years ago. I prefer to rate the man, not the era then project how he would do if he had 100 amateur fights, modern training and nutrition techniques, and Manny Steward as his trainer. Does this make sense?

Or, simply pick a modern person and give the same exact conditions the old timers had to deal with, including feeding then to the wolves’ right out of the gate.

 

That is not how the question was framed, if it was framed at all.

As is typical with these scenario's on this board, this one was sloppily arranged. Do the modern fighters have the training, nutrition, lack of financial support and lack of amateur training that fighters of the 1890's did? Or do we have to extrapolate the fossils with modern training, nutrition and whatnot (which for some would do a disservice)? Are the rulesets the same? No decisions? Corrupt, thrown fights for the local betting set?

People need to ask better questions in order to not get sniping answers.

 

Understood. The question to me was open ended. So I assume the playing field is even in either era. One thing is clear, boxing is on the delcine these days. We could use an Old timer who came out, and went out fighting.

 

Why do you allways say Johnson had a shaky chin?. He was stopped by Klondike on a tko in 5 after putting Klondike down in the first,only the bell saving him,Johnson was a skinny 21 year old .Murderous hitting Choynsky kod Johnson with a body shot,no on else stopped him until he was 37 years old and fat and debauched ,and it took Giant Willard 26 rds in a heat of 105 degrees to do it,The Ketchel knockdown was a fix so how has Johnson a shaky chin ?Mcvey ,Langford,never dented it.From the time he stared fighting to his dethronement by Willard at the age of 37 ,Johnson had 98 fights he was stopped twice ,both times before he was fully matured, once by a body ,shot,he was not counted out against Klondike, it was a tko in 5 and he beat Klondike twice the next year .Up to 1925 ,when he was 47 ,Johnson was stopped 3 times in 118 fights,I dont see a shaky chin at all.He was only counted out once from a shot to the chin ,when totally exhausted he fell from Willards right hand ,after 26 rds in boiling heat.I think you need to revise your opinion of Johnson's chin.Johnson in 118 fights was only floored 3 times.Contrast that with Marciano who is called super durable,in 49 fights he was dropped twice.Or Ali another super chin ,he was dropped 3 times [if you dont count the Wepner step on toe job] and that was in less than half the fights Johnson had.Agenda?