Excellent post:good I was going to reply to that nonsense of his until I read this. Everything I would have said.
The best measuring stick for assessing whether a fighter is shot or not is to compare their current performance with their best performances. A fighter can be past prime and still competitive. But when a fighter can no longer perform at the level they once did and their skill has notably diminished to wear it is not a matter of losing speed or power, but rather they simply CANNOT perform as well as they could regardless and their whole method of fighting is affected, they can be considered shot.
Hopkins is not a shot fighter. Past his prime, yes. But shot? Not yet. Hatton is on his way to shotville, I think.
SHOT FIGHTER: SANTO DOMINGO, Dominican Republic - Former world super bantamweight champion Agapito Sanchez died overnight after being shot in a bar brawl in Santo Domingo, Dominican police said. Sanchez was shot twice by a sergeant of the Dominican armed forces on Sunday after the boxer refused to let the military man dance with his partner, police spokesman Simon Diaz said. Sanchez had been playing dominoes in the bar. Injured in the abdomen, he was operated on in hospital but died on Tuesday morning. He was 35. The gunman was also treated in hospital after being beaten by Sanchez's companions, the police spokesman said. Sanchez held the World Boxing Organization super bantamweight title for almost three years before losing in 2004 to Joan Guzman in San Diego. His last fight was in September in Santo Domingo when he won a points decision against Venezuelan Edison Torres, his 36th victory in 50 professional fights. http://news.ninemsn.com.au/article.aspx?id=72322
. . . I don't know about you people . . . but for me any fighter who can't perform 50% of what he used to be is shot . . . meaning downhill.
People confuse past prime with shot. Leonard vs Hagler, Leonard is past prime. Leonard vs Norris, Leonard is shot.
The simple way to determine a shot fighter, is one who loses to a guy that in his prime, he would have eaten for breakfast - regardless of where the fight was staged, stylistic advantages etc. Now - there can be exceptions, seen as there is a lot of Hatton on this thread, I will go further. Kostya Tszyu was a better fighter than Hatton at their respective primes. Tszyu was late 90's early 00's, whilst Hatton's was either side of this encounter. I wouldn't label Tszyu a shot fighter at that point, because regardless of how good Tszyu was, stylistically Hatton is an absolute nightmare for him at any point in time. He was admittedly past his peak, but still a formidable opponent - in that no other light welter at that point would have beaten him (other than Mayweather). Castillo = shot Morales = shot Barrera = almost shot Calzaghe = past peak De La Hoya = past peak Margarito = prime Haye = prime
Yes, 10 years before that fight Tarver was being beaten by Juan Carlos Gomez in the Ams while Roy was beating James Toney for the Super Middleweight title.
You gave the definition of 'faded' or 'past ones prime', but as long as a fighter has enough left to be competitive at or near the top he is not shot. As a boxer you are shot when the abilities you once had are all gone and you can't compete at a high level anymore. See, guys like Oscar de la Hoya or Bernard Hopkins are not as good as they once were, but still good enough to be counted among the best in their respective divisions, they're not shot yet but they will be one day. Every fighter will.
When his timing is off and he can't pull the trigger when he needs to. When his legs are gone and his defense doesn't allow him to avoid shots when he sees them coming. Or, simply put, "Stevie Johnston".
Generally, a "shot" fighter is one whose reflexes have slowed, and whose overall body movement in the ring seems to lack vitality relative to the fighter's earlier performances. When this happens, it's usually because of advancing biological age, or because the fighter is mentally burned out from too many tough or disappointing fights. When a boxer loses a couple of fights to someone who was previously known to be below him in rating and ability, then we know that boxer is in decline. That's when we start to call him "shot".