What exactly happened in Liston Ali 2

A book I'm reading, "King of the World", is about Ali's life, up till his exile. THere is vast details about the Liston bouts, and I wanted to share with you guys a summary of what happened to Sonny Liston in the second match with Ali:


When they signed to fight the rematch, Liston started training intensely. Here is a passage form the book that looks at his training routine for the build-up of the fight:

"Liston trained for the rematch at a karate and Judo club in south Denver. For the first time since the early days of his career, he seemed determined to prepare himself for a long fight. In the early morning he often drove out to the mountains and ran to the Shrine of Mother Cabrini. He'd run up the 350 steps to the statue of the Sacred Heart and shadowbox there, all alone, breathing the cool mountain air. When it came time to move his camp to New England, Liston set himself up at White Cliffs, a fine old country club near Plymouth Rock with a gold course overlooking the Atlantic. Every Morning Liston ran at least five miles up and down the dunes, and in the afternoons in the gym he went through his exercise routines and sparred. He even worked out with a martial arts instructor to improve his agility. Willie Reddish, his trainer, had been furious with Liston in Miami; he could not bear the way his fighter had dissipated his talent with whiskey and prostitutes. But now Liston was in a monastic mood, angry, focused on beating Ali. Reddish saw a new Liston, or at least the old Liston, the ferocious fighter who had demolished Floyd Patterson twice in less than five minutes, total."

Right before the fight, Ali was hospitalized for a hernia, and the fight was rescheduled. This was the end of Liston. The physical shape he had gotten himself into was all a waste. And not only was all the time he spent wasted, it also meant that his body would never be able to reach that peak again in time for the rescheduled bout. In front of his wife he played it off cool, joking around at first, but he was crushed. He would mutter to himself all night "That damned fool, that damned fool." Liston essentially gave up trying to train his best. He tried to get back in shape but he was feeling miserable. The camp he was training at was damp and wet. He had never been paid his promised $150,000 he was promised for the first fight. He started going out again, drinking. His hopes of going into the ring in good shape were over.


On the way to the fight, on the night of, Ali was talking to a reporter. The reporter had asked Ali how he believe the fight will go. Ali did not go on his usual antics about how bad he was going to whip his opponent. Instead, he was serious. He said it would be a strange fight: "It may start out with me not even throwing a punch. I'm just gonna go backwards and Liston will pursue and then finally, bam!-I'll hit him with the right hand and it's gonna be over." He also was having dreams over and over again about the fight happening in a similar way.

(Paraphrased - pg. 254)

During the fight, as we all know, Ali was dancing around a helpless opponent for a minute, until the "phantom punch" was landed. Mort Sharnik, who had interviewed Ali in the previous paraphrased passage had this to say:
"It was just like Ali had envisioned it on the bus. Liston overloaded on the left, threw it, Ali rode the punch back and away, and Liston fell in toward him, and Ali rose up and brought his right hand up and dropped it as Liston was falling forward. Liston never saw the punch to his cheekbone, and it's the punch you never see that causes you the problem. People say it was a 'phantom punch'. You started hearing that phrase right away. Well, I was sitting with Floyd Patterson and Cus D'Amato. And there was an old Maine state trooper in what looked like a Smokey the Bear hat screaming, "Dammit, he hit him right smack on the chin!' And the bunch of us saw what happened. There was no question in our minds. Not later, but right away."

(pg. 257)

Chicky Ferrara was someone from Dundee's camp who was placed near Liston's corner to insure they wouldn't try cheating again. After the knockdown he said "[Sonny] blinked his eyes three times, like he was trying to clear his head, and I looked at Willie Reddish. I could see Reddish looked sick because he knew his fighter was in trouble."

(Pg. 258)

Ill spare you guys with full details on the confusion with Walcott and the ringside time keepers. Walcott wanted to start counting but Ali was going crazy. Walcott thought Ali was going to kick Liston in the head, or punch him as he was getting up, because he was acting like a mad man. Finally after Liston went up, Nat Fliescher yelled at Walcott to stop the fight, and Joe did.

Heres another passage about Liston after the KO:

"But it wasn't only Ali's conermen who could see that Liston had been stunned. Liston went back to the locker room and softly asked his cutman, Milt Bailey, for smelling salts. 'Smelling salts is nasty-you don't ask for smelling salts if you haven't been hit and hit hard," Bailey said.

(259)

And finally, Liston's thoughts on the matter:
"I didn't think he could hit that hard. I didn't quit. I got hit and hurt good. Clay's right hand caught me high on the left cheekbone and I felt all screwed up. I figured I could beat the count but you don't figure so good when you get clobbered. It wasn't the hardest punch I ever took, but it was hard enough."

Liston also says that he was scared to get up right away, because like Walcott, he thought Ali was going crazy, and was going to hit him as he was getting up.



Well I hope this sheds a little more light on the fight. I know a few of you will really enjoy this information.


Again the info in this post is from the book "King of the Ring" by David Remnick.

 

Oh, so Liston knew before the fight that Nat Fleischer was going to instruct Walcott to halt the fight? He wasn't psychic.

Liston knew the rules. You must go to a neutral corner before the ref starts counting. Why would Liston rush to stand up, when he knows he is entitles a few more seconds until Ali goes to his corner.

The fight was not technically over. Because technically, the count cannot begin until the other fighter goes to a neutral corner.

Why would Liston take a dive? The heavyweight belt was one of the most prized positions in the entire planet at the time. Why would he take the quick payday, when he could have made tons and tons of more money being a champion?

Why would he make it look so obvious? Why would he go down so early? If he was throwing the fight, all he could have done was at least taken a few more rounds. You think Sonny Liston, one of the greatest heavyweight boxers in history, wouldn't go the extra round or two to make it look realistic so to not harm his reputation?

The punch was real
The fight was real
Liston just didn't have the athleticism, age, or the will to fight the greatest boxer in history on one of his best nights.

 

I meant to say heavyweight.

 

The punch connected right on his cheek. His left leg lifted from the ground from impact of the punch. Head snapped, back shaken. Many observers were reported to have said he visibly had "glazey eyes." His trainer had to walk him back to the corner, he needed help getting back there.

The reason it looks fake to you, is because Liston wanted to wait to stand up. He could have stood up. He wanted to stand up. And he DID get up. However, during the time of the knockdown, Ali was all over him shouting like a maniac (mind you something like this hasn't happened before during a prestigious bout for the HW belt). Liston took his time, because Ali never went to his corner, AND he also thought Ali might do something crazy to him while he was getting up. The man was frightened.
He was always bitter about it. He was mad at Fleischer for some time.


Liston lost the fight when Ali got the hernia.

It's my belief that he would have lost under any circumstance, however If the fight hadn't been rescheduled, we might have seen a much more competitive bout then their first meeting.