What if '71 Frazier fought '52 Marciano in a 15 rounder?

Colley Wallace, 6'3 201lb was rated # 10 by ring magazine when charles obliterated him in 10 rounds in 1953.

 

Foreman was gassed in many fights, but only KO'd in one. And actually he was having a bit of a second wind in the 8th, which made him careless. Compare his workrate in that round compared to the two previous ones.

 

One reason is that George actually began the 8th by landing solid, and Ali seemed to freeze up(He went into his shell a bit to defend). I can totally envision George getting a hit of adrenaline from that.

 

Yet he stopped 16 200+ guys, most of them ranked. Among them some of the toughest chins in HW history.

Something I think is sorely missing when talking about "slap-happy, featherfisted Ali" is that he had big problems with his hands, especially his right, during his second career. That's probably a big reason as to why his KO ratio was a lot lower in his second career than his first.

But let's do away with the stats and figures, and just watch when Ali let's it rip against guys like Liston, Williams, Frazier, Lyle and Foreman and tell me he didn't hit harder than Charles. It's just absurd.



[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oD99VbFzqAg[/ame]

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=96MYTogoXLc[/ame]

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SKlxiNol-9M[/ame]

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3jKCxMJdc-Q[/ame]

 

Frazier beats the rock in 5. Jerry Quarry would give the rock a night to remember.

 

And it took 14,5 round to KO Wepner...

Also Williams should have never fought... Guy was crippled.

 

I'm an advocate of Ali not being a featherfist, he had some pop in his punches much like any dude who naturally weighed 220 lbs, coupled with very good accuracy, speed and timing equals KO's. But some of the KO's you posted don't demonstrate this like the Lyle (premature Lyle wasn't seriously hurt), Foreman (he was completely gassed/gave up) and Williams (literally shot, no condition to fight).

 

These are good examples of the often weird type of arguments in here. You make equations of it all, when all you have to do is watch the footage. Yes, Williams was (literally) shot and Foreman was tired (although catching a bit of a second wind), but it's still clear to see that those were hard, and very accurate, punches. Just watch. There's no x you have to solve here.

As an aside - saying Lyle was prematurely stopped is just plain wrong (putting it lightly). A ref that doesn't stop a fight when one fighter takes flush unaswered punches like that should be sacked.

That's what I have to say about this, really. This discussion has derailed the actual thread subject long enough.

 

Both are swarmers, with roughly the same strategy but very different style, fight a guy until later rounds and them knock him the hell out.

I don't see marciano being able to take Joe's left hooks and I don't see marciano being able to tire out Frazier enough to get the knock out on him. Frazier got up 6 times against foreman,probably the strongest boxer in history. I don't see Marciano able to knock him out.

I seen Frazier put down real big guys with his left hook as in 6'4 or 6'3 like bugner, mathis. Marciano era was weaker and I don't think he never defended his title against anyone over 6'0. Frazier would be bigger, faster, hit harder and have equal endurance.I see Frazier knocking out marciano in the 11th with 3 left hooks.

 

You gave the right answer. The new USSR of the USA would be proud.

 

I think Bonavena's counterpunching, lean back, approach would give both Klitschkos fits. Vlad and Vitali would have to get on their bikes the moment they tasted Bonavena's stuff in the trenches.