What if Cassius Clay never became a boxer?

Exactly my point. I still think Holmes natural ability would of been too much.

 

It obviously did. Another 10 years before he ever boxed again I believe.

 

I thought that this thread was more about what Cassius Clay would have done with his life if he hadn't become a boxer...instead of what the heavyweight division would have become without him. I was going to say that Clay would have become the greatest Fuller Brush salesman in history..and would have started his own business that would have involved the development and marketing of grills.

 

:rofl

That was what crossed my mind when I read the thread title.

 

The short answer is that nobody would have dominated the heavyweight division.

Sonny Liston was only heading in one direction going into the fight with Ali and that was towards a good beating. Once a champion stops taking his training seriously he is toast. If all other options had failed then a James Douglas type upset would have occured.

That could have led to the title changing hands a few times.

Frazier would always have taken the title and Foreman would always have beaten him if they fought. I don't think that either Frazier or Foreman was likley to enjoy a long title reign.

Frazier lost focus after he won the title and never had a style suited for longevity. If he had not fought Ali then he would have got into a war with sombody like Ron Lyle that would have taken something out of him.

Foreman despite his impresive record had never gone past ten rounds going into the Ali fight. A Muhamad Ali or a Jimmy Young was always going to upset him and if they didn't he would still have discoverd god.

That leaves a bit of a mudle untill Larry Holmes comes allong.

 

He was asked this question once and he said:

"I wouldf have been top notch at something else. If I had been a garbage man I would have been the worlds greatest garbage man."

Of course that is mere pretention on his part.

I worked on the bins for two years to pay my way through uni and he would never have been competitive with me.

 

In this parallel existence, though - there's no apprenticeship under Ali as a sparring partner. There's no Ali laying down the blueprint and blazing a trail with his style...I'd like to think Holmes would rise to the top anyway with all these factors taken out of consideration, but I'm just not sure.

 

I agree with the notion that Liston would have dropped the title by the time Frazier rose to prominence. The man clearly had demons, was inconsistent in his training and had handlers that would sell him out as soon as they thought it would make a few bucks to do so. No way he lasts another 4 years.

Foreman without the Ali defeat is a really interesting question. I have no clue how that would go - he'd always have trouble with Jimmy Young, but if he were a dominant champ, may have walked away with a questionable decision. Foreman is such a quixotic character, it would seem impossible to predict.