What if Frazier and Ali fought in the 60s?

Where is your evidence that Alis jaw was broken on the first round...which then became the second round once Alis corner realized no hard blow was struck by Norton in the first round? Still waiting.

 

And, is he right about you?

"Houdini used to be capfunds aka bitchass. He's one of the most lunatic posters on the board, has been forever. "

Posted by McGrain on the 2nd of this month.

"In the second round, he caught Ali along the ropes and delivered a right uppercut. Most experts believe Ali’s jaw was broken with that punch, but he battled on gamely for 10 more rounds."

Matt Schudel. The Washington Post.

"Norton was a thickly muscled ex-Marine who had little notoriety when he faced Ali on March 31, 1973, at the San Diego Sports Arena. But Norton broke Ali's jaw in the second round and went on to earn a split-decision victory that would define him as one of his era's greats."

Kevin Iole. Boxing writer ,who has contributed to many magazines ,including The Ring
.
There are many more but I just posted a couple because I wanted to show that your contention that all the scribes were unanimous about the break happening late in the fight is incorrect.

These couple of opinions are no more valid than your saying airily that it happened in the 12 rd.
Bottom line ,you dont know when it happened any more than anyone else does.
My position, [as a despicable human being ,] is without definitive proof to the contrary, I'm not prepared to call Ali,Youngblood,Pacheco,and Dundee liars.

Quite honestly I couldn't care less when it happened, but it seems to me that you have a particularly phobic need to persuade others that it was the last round. That strikes me as unatural, unhealthy, and unbalanced.
I'm backing no one but myself.
It is a matter of record that many fighters have continued in fights that saw them sustain a broken jaw early on in a fight. Ruddock v Tyson, Liston v Marshall, Finnegan v Reiche,and Abraham against Miranda, Abraham is particularly valid in this context because he had his jaw broken in two places in the 4th rd, yet battled on for another 8rds to win . So we do know that some fighters are capable of doing so, whatever else we may feel about Ali I think most objective posters would not question his courage,[ you may be the exception]. It is therefore undeniably possible that Ali did the same against Norton.

I repeat ,I didn't read Foxy's posts and I'm not responsible for whatever he called you.

Neither do I give a **** about your opinion of me ,because as McGrain emphatically stated by calling you a lunatic, you are clearly unhinged ,and as such your opinion is worthless.

I'll go now because it's time for Nurse Ratched to give you your medication.

 

And everyone is waiting for your PROOF regarding your mentally ******ed obsession with round 12, but I'm a generous kind of guy, so I'll even give you a chance of PROVING Futch's choice of round 11.

After all YOU ARE the one calling Ali, and everyone else in his team that night LIARS.

Eventually if we keep going round and round, your thick brain will get the simple message.

Call someone a liar, you need to PROVE it. You haven't so far, no matter how feeble and desperate your efforts.

 

I have a doctors opinion who is not related to Alis camp do you?


Chicago Tribune May 13 1973

"The decision really was not in doubt. The only controversy was when Alis jaw was broken. Ali said round one while Norton insisted it was in round 12. Dr. Fredrick Barnes who has a practice downtown looked at the xray of Alis broken jaw he feels that the injury had to have happened late in the fight. "The ends of the bones at the break were very close together. Had the break happened early and was beaten upon for many rounds that gap would have been wider". "With such a complete break I would have expected some level of injury to the other side of Alis jaw since it would be taking the full brunt of Nortons punches for so many rounds." Another claim by Ali was that he sprained his ankle but he spent the entire 11th round dancing and moving so just how badly could the injury have been?"

You can find many today who will just repeat Alis camps claim. That does not mean in the months just after the bout this alibi was greatly questioned.

All the evidence points to a round 12 jaw breaking. No evidence points to a round one incident. As I have posted. Where is your evidence? Still waiting.

McGrain calls you every name under the sun also. You should be ashamed of yourself for jumping on me when this poster curses at everyone in every post. Despicable.

 

You keep spouting some guy who wrote for a Chicago newspaper and had a doctor friend in a downtown surgery.

That proves NOTHING, unless the guy was an orthopedic surgeon. Did this quack examine Ali? Did he have any knowledge of Ali personally, that might qualify him to declare the limit of Ali's pain threshold?

You have been given other examples by other Muricans of other writers, who wrote the opposite of your hang up with the 12th round.

Again PROVE Ali, and his camp were lying et al, or shut up.

 

There is a Doctor's opinion that it happened in the second round Ferdie Pacheco's and he happened to be there at the time.

There is no conclusive evidence for either Foxy or you, when are you going to grasp that?
I'm not ashamed of myself at all .I don't feel any responsibilty for what another poster calls you, especially as I didn't even read his posts.
I did read yours and you were being quite free with the insults .
What makes you superior and in possession of the high moral ground here?
You have come across as mentally unhinged ,and so hysterically thin skinned, you don't seem to inhabit the real world.


McGrain is entitled to his opinion.

To my knowledge he has never called me a lunatic .

 

Why did Alis doctor change the round the break was supposed to occur? He is a doctor correct? He was there correct? It went from happening in round 1 to round two...why?

You like believing in things where no evidence exists. Most educated people don't.

The evidence points to only one conclusion. There is no evidence whatsoever that points to a round one or round two jaw breaking. Lots of evidence that points to a round 12 incident including a doctors opinion based on The xray of the break.

Its not really a question of my opinion ....this was the belief of every major boxing writer and boxing periodicals from the time that I am aware of. Boxing history 101.

 

Your not a lunatic. You are indeed a despicable human being.

 

Coming from you I take that as a compliment.Cheers:good

 

Yes but You were the one who degraded me after I defended myself against the foulest mouthed poster on these boards. Like I said...your a despicable human being.

 

You are delusional to the point of lunacy.

You haven't defended anything.You have OFFENDED anyone and everyone with your arrogant opinion that you know more than them.

You have offended people with your stupid belief that one of, if not THE most respected fighters on earth is a liar, and anyone who believes he isn't needs to prove so.

Like I said you're loony tunes. Its a shame your not made of chocolate really isn't it?

That way you could lick yourself to death.

 

Where is your evidence that Alis jaw was broken in round one...or was it round two?

Such talk from the foulest mouthed poster on these boards. But still am waiting for some logical thinking....so far nothing.

If you remember Ali also had many excuses as to why he lost to Frazier two years earlier. He never gave Joe the credit at that time and for years that he fought a great fight and beat him fair and square in 71

The broken jaw in round one claim was a convenient way to explain why he lost to a fighter he was supposed to beat easy.

 

Just keep lying Walter.

You have already been shown quotes from Ali where he says.

" I didn't give the fight away. Joe EARNED it "

Is your paranoid mind so dumb it can't see that that is giving a guy credit?


You see when you pervert things the way you do, as in the instance above, people find it very hard to take you seriously.

 

If you think Ali did not have every excuse in the world after he lost to Frazier insisting he won the bout and giving Joe no credit for years for really beating him...you need to read a book on boxing history.

NY times May 15. 1971
That unanimous, seemingly indisputable decision? A gift, according to Ali from racially motivated White Judges. Much like morality...or decency, reality had little to do with what Ali said regarding Frazier. He wanted to convince his adoring public that Joe was an imposter who was handed a victory he did not deserve.

Look up any newspaper account from the time all you will read is how Ali says he really won the fight, the judges were white and Frazier was an Uncle Tom.

Do your own research I am tired of trying to educate you.

Where is your evidence that Alis jaw was broken in round one which Alis doctor changed to round two? Two days and you have shown nothing.

 

I think I'll just stick to the one thread, entitled " Who gives Ali nightmares " as it's easier than jumping from one to the other.

By the way I've just exposed another of your lies on there by throwing your own words back at you, which you denied writing.