What if Nat Fleischer were still alive today??

Bukkake, I have an old Ring mag from around '69 or '70 that had a monthly series that did something unique for the time. They fed data into one of those new-fangled computers (it was probably a friggin' room-sized Univac) and had it perform an all-time middleweight tournament. I can't recall the entire tourney, I remember a Basilio-Cerdan fight, but it was the final that made me take notice. Stanley Ketchel vs. Sugar Ray Robinson, and Robinson won. Well, the following month (or maybe it was that month) Nat was so pissed he wrote a scathing article accompanying it, saying that this just couldn't happen. He was really taken aback by it. He couldn't come to grips with a dissenting opinion. Which makes me think that he may have been a bear to work for, which is why he was surrounded by yes-men. I can envision the sign on the Ring's hallowed halls now, "Independent thinking will get you the door!"

Scartissue

 

Burt, never at any point in my text did I try to denigrate our greatest generation (a monicker I agree with). I am fully aware of the contempt they had for Ali over his refusal, which is understandable. My point is that it seethed over into their writing. As for the hand-cranked newsreels, my point is that he did not see everyone of his top-notchers live. How could he? He would have been 10 years old during Fitzsimmons prime and he has him rated #3. Above Dempsey, Louis, Marciano, Liston, Ali, Frazier. How did he this but from what he read and from newsreels. A childhood hero is what he was. But aside from this, as I said in my first post, Nat did alot for boxing. I may not agree with everyting he wrote, indeed, I may not agree with a lot he wrote, but there is no denying his passion for the sport we all fell in love with, including the heroes of our youth.

Scartissue

 

Nat Fleisher did not see the prime Fitz Fight 1894-1900, but he knew of
Ruby Robert,s great reputation...
But scartissue , you owe it to yourself to read an article about OLD FITZ.
Written by a great writer named EDGAR LEE MASTERS, who SAW Fitz in his prime, and all the great Heavyweights til Joe Louis..It will opoen your eyes this piece about Fitz's place in history...The name of this book,I have is Sports Illustrated "THE BOOK OF BOXING" by Heinz and WARD.Page 228
1999..Fascinating book and great article about Fitz,from a poet and boxing buff who saw Fitz to Joe Louis...b.b.

 

I think the consensus for a long, long time with many if not all of the writers that saw both eras was that Sullivan, Fitz, Jackson, Corbett were a class above the challengers of Johnsons era. Johnson and Jeffries did have their supporters, but thier challengers did not. I dont even think Langford Jeanette and McVey enjoyed anywhere nearthe reputation of those 4 earlier fighters. If those who saw both, are indeed correct, it certainly shakes up many modern lists and thoughts.

 

BUMP. We now have nearly 11 more years of boxing since the last post in this thread. What if Immortal Nat continued his list to say the top 20 or 25? Does Wladimir Klitschko get on that list? I believe he does. In the Heavyweights, I would imagine that Ali. Frazier, Holmes, Tyson, Foreman, Holyfield, Lewis, and, yes, probably Klitschko, might find spots on Nat's list. Walcott? Baer? Liston? Charles? Willard? Burns? Tom Sharkey? Wills? McVey? I had better stop. I think that's 27.

 

He'd probably be bullied on Twitter.

 

Jack Johnson would undoubtedly still be Nat's No. 1 All-time heavyweight!!

 

Like someone we know and love, Lol.

 

What makes (made?) you think Nat would have rated Foreman? If Nat had seen the Rumble in the Jungle, he probably would have insisted that it exposed Foreman as a second-rate titlist (at best).

 

I read that he had scored the Karl Mildenberger vs Muhammad Ali title bout in Sept 1966.

 

How did he score it?

 

According to boxrec Nat had it 7-3-1 for Ali as well as another judge. The third judge had it 7-2-2 for Ali. This is all after 11 completed rounds.

 

By that time Foreman had decimated Frazier. I doubt he’d write him off that easy, but who knows?

 

When I get a chance, I'm going to see if I can find any interviews of old former champions commenting on any of those Ali-Frazier-Foreman fights.

 

Would be genuinely curious if Foreman had notable detractors pre-Ali and post-Frazier. Seemed like the whole world feared George at the time.