What if... Ron Lyle hadn't gone to prison?

I like you man but seriously?

 

Absolutely, what Lyle went through, made him what he was, in the ring and in life. Had Lyle grew up in a middle class neighborhood and not gone to prison he'd have probably played football. The same can be said of Sonny Liston,,,what if......

 

He apparently coached the prison football team to a championship. I assume that means he played football beforehand as you’d need some knowledge of the sport to coach.

 

I agree, this is a great thread! But I feel you're overrating Lyle some.

 

Its hard to say. He would have been younger but that doesnt always equate to being better. He got a late start but he was a great athlete and wasnt taking punishment so like Hopkins used to say “he was sittin on the shelf like grandmas peaches”. I think his career would have been longer but I dont think he would have been much better. He was a talented boxer already, tough, big and had a good punch. What more would have been added to his game? Like I said, I think some of those losses at the end of his career wouldnt be there but thats about it. He didnt lose to Ali, Foreman, and Young because of his lack of experience or his age. You moght say he lost to Quarry because of his lack of experience but I dont even know if that was a factor. His problem was that he could be kind of mechanical and kind of predictable but thats a problem for a lot of big guys like that, especially muscle bound guys like Lyle. In that regard he reminds me of Mac Foster but he was better than Foster.

 

Well the original ask was about Lyle not going to prison and boxing instead. In 1962 when Patterson lost his title to Liston Lyle would have been about 21 so I dont see him beating Patterson. Terrell was "champion" from 1965 to 1967 which was really his prime. Lyle would have been 24-26 years old. Maybe he'd beat Terrell who was probably the weakest link of the three guys you listed above but I dont really even consider that a lock. Lyle didnt have great stamina and Terrell knew how to tire guys out. Lyle also wasnt as fast and graceful as Ali or a seek and destroy guy so at best he might win a pedestrian decision. Ellis did better than remembered in his fight with Lyle when he was shot and Lyle was in his prime so I dont see Lyle defeating the 1968 version of Ellis. I think Ellis would have been cracking him with that sneak right hand all night long and moving out of the way. I think Lyle was a good, fun, solid gatekeeper type contender but I just dont know if he was ever championship caliber. He was a very high quality contender in a deep era but he had some stylistic and physical issues that make me suspect he would have never gotten over the hump to greatness.

 

Watching Lyle struggle with an old fat Peralta doesnt give me much hope he’d beat Ellis. Ellis made his career beating heavyweights he shouldnt have. He had better wheels than Peralta and a bigger punch. Id favor him over Lyle. Not by much but the more Ive seen of both the more my opinion has gone up for Ellis. Im still big on Lyle but he was beatable by a wide array of styles and sizes. He could be outpunched, outboxed, and out worked and it didnt take a giant to do it. And again, he was rocked by Ellis when Ellis was shot and couldnt put him away even when he had him in the corners and on the ropes. Id hate to think what a prime Ellis would have done there.

 

I havent watched the Martin fight in a long time but I dont remember him being punched out. Ellis had a tougher fight against Bonavena, went the distance, and won without looking worn out. Like I said, he was totally shot and had no legs against Lyle and still stung him and went the distance at a time when Lyle was about as good as he ever got. I just dont see it. Youd have to think Lyle would be a lot better starting earlier and not going to Prison to improve upon that performance against a prime Ellis, whereas there is no doubt that Ellis was much better in 1968 than he was in 1974.

 

Yes. The only people you picked to beat him were Ali and Frazier. This is a gross over-exaggeration.