Hi George, question, I do agree that Pacquiao defeating top welters like Cotto, Bradley, and Thurman are one of his finest career achievements but I do want to clarify something you mentioned. You mentioned Pac winning the lineal welterweight title was his career best achievement. My question was which fight exactly did Pacquiao become the lineal welterweight champion? I always get confused when that topic arises as I thought the lineal welterweight crown was vacated once Mayweather retired in 2015 (not counting the exhibition fights with McGregor and other YouTubers).
Okay, so for sure Mosley was the lineal champion in like the early 2000s after defeating De La Hoya as they were #1 and #2. Then Mosley got beat by Forrest, who got beat by Mayorga, who then got beat by Cory Spinks, then by Zab Judah, and got beat by Baldomir, who finally got beat by Mayweather. Mayweather end up having a "retirement" for like a year and a half. According to sources like linealboxingchampion.com, there is not a new lineal champion until #1 and #2 faces each other. Around 2009-ish, Margarito was mostly seen as the #1 welterweight after defeating one of the top welterweights in Cotto (cheat or no cheat, still a mystery for Margarito). Mosley was still rebounding from a loss to Cotto so I think it was likely that he wasn't the consensus #2 guy but did became #1 after knocking out Margarito. Also, in 2010, when Mayweather was to face Mosley, Mayweather seemed to be unrated by many boxing organizations due to coming back from a "retirement" while Mosley remains #1. In my opinion, I think Mayweather became the next lineal champion after claiming in 2008 after he defeated Pacquiao (who took back the #2 spot after outboxing Bradley (consensus #2 guy after Mayweather, in which Bradley outpointed top P4P welterweight contender Juan Manuel Marquez)). Is this how you guys trace the lineal welterweight championship since the early 2000s?
Good points. Cotto was considered the number 1 guy in the division once Mayweather had retired but the ring Magazine Title was still considered vacant. Cotto had beaten number 2 or 3 Mosley, paul williams lost to Quintana, which moved up Margarito a few spots while Mosley and Williams dropped back. When cotto and Margarito fought its concievable that they were the number 1 and number 2 in many peoples eyes. Cotto then lost To Margarito making him the number 1 guy, cotto came back and fought Clottey but that really wasnt for a lineal title. Pac had 1 fight at 147 prior to fighting Cotto. Imo tho Margarito was still the man of the division when Mosley beat him thus making him the lineal champion in my eyes.just my opinion.
Sure thing. Of course there is no 100% right answer and it's not inconceivable to say that Margarito vs Mosley can determine the next champion of the lineage. After, most of the guys that we mentioned already were the top welterweights at the time and it was very good that they were fighting each other, which is healthy for the sport (not like the boxing politics of today).
Let me ask you this though, what did Amir Khan do at welterweight though to deserve a Pacquiao fight? Khan had most of his successes at 140. In terms of all time great legacy, I don't think missing this fight affects Pac's legacy at all in terms of all time P4P ranking but if this fight happens, it may do very well financially (considering both men were pretty rich boxers) so maybe we might be missing a big cash-out fight.
I'll take Barrera...as good as the cotto fight and win was... Barrera took an absolute hiding that night that noone saw coming..it was a phenomenal performance
Barrera 1 Cotto was catchweight and coming off a huge hiding from margarito Thurman next, because Pac showed he could still mix with the younger guys
Well he never looked the same following his departure Khan also looked much better under Ariza He must be some strength/condition coach
