What is the right style to beat a prime Roy Jones?

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by fists of fury, May 25, 2012.


  1. fists of fury

    fists of fury Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    ...Been watching a fair bit of Roy in his prime years recently, and there are few other fighters that I'm aware of, that caused such a nightmare for their opponent.

    The man had speed and power off the charts, a highly unorthodox style, and razor sharp reflexes. He was also very mobile and clever at setting traps for opponents.

    I'd really like some input from anyone who is an expert on Jones, or a veteran Jones watcher, or anyone who feels they can contribute something meaningful to the thread.

    The mission is simple:

    Input is needed on what to do, and what not to do, against a Roy Jones at 168 or 175.
    I'm not looking for a list of potential opponents and don't want matchups. I'm looking for a styles breakdown on Jones and also what it would take to beat him, from a styles perspective, at 168. (175 is fine as well)

    Not an easy task, I know.
    Qualified trainers probably thought they had him figured out, until their fighter got beaten up by Jones.
    But, I have faith in Classic to come up with something. Help me out here, gents.

    Here is my first tentative stab:

    One thing I've noticed (And Toney made this mistake) is that to duck under Jones' shots could be a bad mistake, since Jones would just skip around the ducking Toney, usually clockwise, and belt him while Toney was unsighted.
    Poor Toney didn't have a clue where Jones was coming from, with his eyes on the floor.

    Another thing that I feel is a mistake against Jones, is to lean in with shots. Fighters who did this had nearly all their weight on their lead foot, and leaning in with a punch. At that juncture, there was little they could do to take evasive action if required.
    Jones, with those incredibly swift hands and quick reflexes, would belt opponents leaning in, often with a sharp left hook or sometimes the right hand over the jab.
    I think fighters leaned in against Jones simply because he was so quick at moving out of range.
    With their slower hands, it must have been frustrating for opponents to continually fall short with their punches. They had to do something, and leaning in was a natural consequence.
    This was one of the traps Jones seemed to set...get fighters to lean in, and then belt them with lead hooks or right hands.

    Lastly, rushing Jones to the ropes often produced a similar result to a fighter leaning in. Perhaps again out of frustration, opponents would occasionally just rush at him, again to be met with a counter or lead left hook or right hand. Jones was just that quick that he could get away with it.

    Maybe it's just me, but the (oddly enough) Virgil Hill fight may offer one or two clues as to what to do. Yes, the fight ended in devastating fashion for Jones, but that's somewhat incidental.

    Hill had a measure of success with the jab, for one thing. Maybe because he doubled up with it, or maybe because he found his range quicker than Jones in that fight, but for whatever reason, he had some success with it.

    Hill usually fought tall, although he did lean in occasionally against Jones, but Jones, maybe because he was a little rusty, didn't make him pay.
    Anyway, Hill fought tall, not providing Jones with his usual countering opportunities.
    How much success this would have yielded if the fight had gone on longer is anyone's guess, but I feel that to fight tall against Jones is a damn side more preferable than attempting to duck under his shots.

    Anyway, I'd really appreciate some input from guys that have extensively watched Jones, or from anyone who feels they have something meaningful to contribute.

    Thanks. :good
     
  2. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    Nice post.

    I would say a puncher who can set his own traps is going to be the worst match for Roy on paper. Punchers generally are what you want to put in with him, but a Benn is just going to get KTFO for me.
     
  3. fists of fury

    fists of fury Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    How would you set traps for him, McGrain? What would you instruct your fighter to do?
    I know I'm asking for a lot, because firstly, our hypothetical fighter needs some decent virtues himself. I know it's a bit up in the air...

    Would you feel getting Roy to lead would produce any results?

    (Agreed about Benn...Roy would have a field day with that style.)
     
  4. Lester1583

    Lester1583 Can you hear this? Full Member

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    Jabs never truly troubled Jones.

    Nor did come-forward punchers or bullrushing tactics.

    Safety-first counter punching approach did (to some extent).

    A combination of what Harding, Griffin and Hopkins all tried to do.

    Mind you this would work much better with light heavyweght and preferably declining version of Jones (after 2000's version).

    Where he simply doesn't have the legs and generally a smaller man.

    Still Jones is much faster than anybody in history of the weight and hits pretty hard which makes the task of countering him and keeping him at bay a very hard thing to do.
     
  5. Flea Man

    Flea Man มวยสากล Full Member

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    Nice post.

    As McGrain said, a trap-setter is the best bet. So essentially it's a glorified punchers chance against Roy.

    Someone horrifically awkward who could time him? Mike Spinks IMO.
     
  6. Lester1583

    Lester1583 Can you hear this? Full Member

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    By the way, even Senya who probably watched all Jones fights 10 times and in slo-mo (no offense, Senya) would tell you the same thing that I said, fof.:lol:
     
  7. Lester1583

    Lester1583 Can you hear this? Full Member

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    Ezz is a good choice too.
     
  8. lora

    lora Fighting Zapata Full Member

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    Someone durable enough to take some shots they might not see coming and with the balls and skill to just wade right in with some finesse.

    IF Qawi was in the mood, he'd be a good bet to get it done.
     
  9. frankenfrank

    frankenfrank Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    Reggie Johnson was past his prime by d time he fought Jones and a smaller man . If d ages & sizes were reversed and Jones left d ring on a stretcher wearing oxygen mask , ppl would have said that Johnson had that perfect style .
    Put a drained Jones against n inshape Toney and Toney eventually counters him 2 submission .
    Reverse ages again , and Merqui Sosa at least gives Jones a close fight .
    Reverse ages and McCallum stops him .
    It's only fair when Jones is d younger & bigger man , then he had d style 2 beat every1 . I've even seen serious predictions like Jones stopping David Haye @ 200 lbs .
     
  10. Flea Man

    Flea Man มวยสากล Full Member

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    Interesting. I think Roys left hand would baffle Qawi myself.
     
  11. PowerPuncher

    PowerPuncher Loyal Member Full Member

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    Agree with this, you have to out technical or out think Jones. But you do need a masterful jab and some speed to pull it off. Southpaw angles gave him a little bit of an issue too

    The only fighter with a chance to pull it off is Ezzard Charles. Foster and Spinks have punchers chances, I don't think Moore does.
     
  12. Lester1583

    Lester1583 Can you hear this? Full Member

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    Nah, Michalczewski is better (
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    than those overrated old-timers.

    And Jones knew it - that's why he ducked him fearing the inevitable crushing defeat.:lol:
     
  13. Flea Man

    Flea Man มวยสากล Full Member

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    I actually think Moore has a better chance than Charles. The Ol' Mongoose gave a less orthodox look than Ezzard did. I think everything counts when pitting someone against Roy.
     
  14. Lester1583

    Lester1583 Can you hear this? Full Member

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    He'd get burley'd to death;):D
     
  15. PowerPuncher

    PowerPuncher Loyal Member Full Member

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    Too much of a speed disparity in both handspeed and reflexes imo I don't think his jab or left hook is good enough either and he's not suckering Roy onto his right either

    I actually think Harold Johnson could be much more competitive than Moore

    The problem with setting traps is it can leave you vulnerable