Who has Sam Soliman or the shot mental patient beat from the current crop of the MW you mentioned to nake them look bad? Soliman recently got demolished by an 8 fight prospect. "They get demolished by anyone half decent north and south." There's no base to this whatsoever. The only reason guys like DeGale, Jack, Groves get more attention than Sauners, Jacobs, CEJ etc is because they don't have an elite talent to make them look average. If Ward was still around @ 168, his haters would be busting their asses off to trash those guys, just like you're doing with MW contenders. If DeGale vs CEJ gets made later this year as I suspect it might, It'll be a pick 'em. Or take a look at Chudinov bros. One of them is arguably top5 @ 168 and should've been a titlist right now while his equally mediocre brother was barely top15 @ 160.
His amateur pedigree makes him an exception.. hes the real deal anyone with eyes can see that. He was 23-1 in world series of boxing which is professional boxing all against top fighters. he is the greatest ever WSB fighter. You are backtracking you claimed they would beat them EASILY. Williams & the weak Charlo and past it Cotto would be big underdogs and wouldn't almost definitely lose to them Andrade is so unproven and inactive it's quite a ridiculous prediction he could move up a division and beat the top guys there.. he'd probably get Ko'd. Alvarez is really a middleweight now.. but you keep holding onto your only p4p guy in your precious division lol. Light middle is a joke. None of the guys there are big names internationally apart from ,Alvare whos moving up. It lacks both p4p fighters and quantity of very good fightes.
Well again, the current crop of middleweights consists of Eubank Jr(prospect who is best known in a losing effort against domestic champ Saunders) Jacobs(look at the Sergio Mora fights and tell me that this guy is a top fighter) Andy Lee(I love Andy Lee and have been seeing him for years, but he's B level at best) Saunders(domestic level champ, hasn't really done anything besides win close fights against Lee and Eubank Jr). Honestly, this current crop of fighters is pathetic. You can't look at me with a straight face and claim these are elite fighters. DeGale is an established world champion with experience and size on his side. How in the blue hell do you see that as a pick em fight with CEJ? What has CEJ done to make you think that? How long have you been watching boxing? That's an absurd comment that has no weight behind it. Jacobs has been getting attention from HBO for years, he was limited then and couldn't get past contender level when the MW division was popping with Pavlik, Martinez, Chavez Jr, Paul Williams, Pirog etc. Fast forward to today and the MW division has officially become Bum Land and Jacobs is the number 1 contender of the world LMFAO. Also, wtf does Ward have to do with anything? You're saying anything now to try and get a point across and failing miserably. Ward is the p4p best fighter in the world, he beats everyone 168 and below.
Yawn... Your whole argument lies on amateur pedigree, I've heard the same exact thing about Korobov. I'm not even gonna mention his amateur achievements, because I'm sure you already know. I'm also sure you know about him getting flattened by Brian Vera's son Andy Lee. So let's talk about the current top 5 middleweights instead of people you think are top. Rest of the post is garbage strawman. A crude one dimensional caveman, a prospect with a loss, a domestic level champ, a glass jawed slugger and a glass jawed B level fighter with a decent right hook are what the top 5 fighters of MW consist of. Let that sink in. You and I both know why they call it bum land.
I've seen plenty of fights from both DeGale and Eubank Jr to suggest Junior's athleticism, conditioning, stamina and workrate would give Chunky who went life and death with very average fighters in the past all he could handle, not just his fight with BJS but his other fights including the one against Chudinov(see the part you avoided from my previous post). I hope It gets made so we can see. DeGale is basically the SMW Saunders, good talent but poor conditioning. Youu GGG haters can't stop talking about Jacobs getting dropped by Mora, It supposedly making the division "bumland", then what does that make the SMW the probably best fighter of which got KOd by an a lot lesser fighter to Mora? Jacobs was a young prospect around the time you mentioned when he got crushed by Pirog(whom I'd favour over anyone at or below 160 bar GGG) now he resurrected his career and proved himself a top, quality contender. Suffering a flash KD in a reckless moment doesn't change that. Saunders, Jacobs, Eubank, I don't think these guys are elite. But neither are DeGale, Jack or Groves. That's why I mentioned Ward, I thought I explained why but I'll repeat: The reason top guys at 168 are getting more attention from the top contenders at 160 is because they don't have and elite talent like Ward(you can take Froch or Kessler as an example as well) to dominate them and make them look average.And yes, If he was still around at 168, Ward haters would be doing their best to trash the top contenders so they could **** on his opposition, which is exactly what you're doing with contenders at 160. Your arguments are the ones that have no weight behind them, you just call fighters "bums" and claim "they'd lose to this, they'd lose to that, anyone half decent would beat them" without any validity to it.
A 4 round fighter with the gas tank of a 50 year old, a glass jawed, slow, unathletic boxer with decent skills at best, a shot to **** 40 year old Cobra victim, the KO victim of a 40 year old man with again the gas thank of a 45 year old, a 15 fight novice with limited power and limited skills. I see why they call it a bumland now.
Jacobs is a legitimate fight for ggg and all that I want from him. About time he earned his p4p status. That's not hating. Before I started holding ggg accountable, there wasn't that many doing it which is why I do it. Now there was enough pressure on him to make the Jacobs fight and stop the boxing poltiics bull****. That's progress. I'm not the one to diss Jacobs just to get at ggg, that would be foolish. Though I would if Jacobs sucked I would say so but he doesn't. He is absolutely legit and dangerous. Hard to argue that Middleweight is not **** so why even try. We know the level of most of the MW top 15 and it doesn't look good. Honestly, a lot of these guys trying to deny the talent of a boxer like Andrade just exposes them as DKSAB at best.
Like stated before, DeGale is an established world champion who has the size, reach, skills and experience over the prospect Eubank Jr. Why do you keep mentioning these Chud bros? What have they done in boxing and who have they beat? I know one of them lost a paper title against a shot to **** Felix Sturm at 168, there really isn't much to be said. I'm not interested in talking about tomato cans, stop bringing up bums. What has Jacobs changed about his style since losing to Pirog? He's a crude face first slugger who again, was only fringe contender at best in a stacked MW division. He's not like Jack who noticeably changed his tactics by employing more defense and pressure while under the tutelage of Floyd Mayweather. Jacobs is one dimensional and only depends on his power. He's the number 1 MW contender in the world now due to 160 turning into bum land. Why do you think this guy is elite? He got an early knock out over an unmotivated Quillin, what else has he done? DeGale, Jack and Zurdo beat worthy top contenders to be in the position they're in now. Why are you mentioning Groves? He's fringe top 10 at best after getting ruined by Carl Froch, and even he was able to beat up a top 5 MW contender in Murray(only after a shot 400 year old Abraham out hustled him first). Let's look at the top 5 wins of Jack, Degale and Zurdo compared to Saunders, Jacobs and Eubank. Saunders Andy Lee Chris Eubank ??? Chris Eubank That Chud guy ??? ??? Jacobs Quillin Sergio Mora Ishe Smith DeGale Lucian Bute Andre Dirrell George Groves(i thought DeGale won) Jack James DeGale George Groves Lucian Bute Zurdo Arthur Abraham Derek Edwards Vlasov It really isn't close. Again, they call it bum land for a reason. 160 is absolutely horrible.
Who are these fighters you're talking about? Only division that is universally known as bum land is the middleweight division and GGG is the King of Bum Land.
Problem with that theory is none of the 3 you'd mention would beat a Willie Monroe, whose biggest shortcoming on this board is that he had the audacity to get knocked out by GGG. Had GGG not taken that fight, Monroe would be rated significantly higher now and I have zero doubts people would use him as a boogeyman to show how GGG avoids slick fighters.
Strawweight Don't know why it isn't on there. After 3 wins against guys with losing records you can already become a top 100 fighter. If you're European, after 1 fight win lose or draw you're the #1 European at 105.
I'm not arguing jr MW is the worst, I don't think It is. And I think Andrade is a legit p4p level talent as long as he stays active, I'd pick him over both Canelo and Lara. And you might have a point on why Jacobs is getting overpaid, but we know he's been offered the GGG fight before. Jr. MW has better top7-8 than MW, but It doesn't have better top15-top20. Which is what I meant by depth and why I brought up Smith and Thompson fighting for a world title, the equilavent of it would be Willie Monroe and Spike O'Sullivan fighting for a vacant title at 160.
Way to twist things in your favour. If DeGale was a MW, you won't shut up about him going life and death with a "journeyman", or that "Polish bum". And KDs were the only difference in his fight with shot Dirrell who's been on the decline for 6 years. He has no improvements and plenty weaknesses to exploit. The same way you think he beat Groves, CEJ supporters believe he beat BJS. And Jacobs was never a "fringe contender". He was considered the top prospect around Martinez's, Chavez's time and got KOd by a great fighter. He didn't become a different fighter, I'd still favour Pirog over this version. But he reached his potential that was expected around the "stacked MW" time. He's far from a face first, cude slugger. He's a puncher with very good athleticism, great hand speed and decednt skills. I keep mentioning Groves because he's clearly, clearly on the same level as DeGale and Jack. He'd have a fair chance against both in the rematches as well. But you're insisting on not getting my point. I don't think Jacobs, Saunders or Jacobs are elite, I said that in my previous post too. But, I don't think DeGale, Jack or other at 168 are elite either. Their fights with Groves and shot Bute told me that. Yes, they have better resumes than the contenders at 160 because they fight each other, that's what happens when there isn't a dominanant champion in the division and the titles are up for grabs. And the Ring champ and the Ring #1 at MW isn't even included to comprasion.
