What was the bigger decrease in Skill that you notice in Tyson post-prison?

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by Vic-JofreBRASIL, Feb 1, 2013.



  1. PowerPuncher

    PowerPuncher VIP Member Full Member

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    Sounds good, I'll check back tomorrow, it's 1:30am here and I have to get my businesses delivery orders out for midday tomorrow/today, so it's hitting the hay for me mate :good
     
  2. Manassa

    Manassa - banned

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    Raping was better plus books
     
  3. Saintpat

    Saintpat Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    No real discernable physical differences. They had more to do with his mental state:

    1) Never in prime condition again -- lack of willingness to sacrifice and train the way an elite heavyweight has to train

    2) This really started before prison but really began to show after: stubborness in refusing to hire a trainer he respected, someone who he would yield his will to and allow himself to be trained into proper shape, to utilize proper defense, to formulate a fight plan that depended on more than intimidation.

    In short, Tyson came out of prison without the fire that would make him do whatever it took to be the best in the world, even though he probably still had the skills. Way too many idiotic decisions about who he allowed into his inner circle and about who would run his camp and how it would be run.
     
  4. zadfrak

    zadfrak Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    Tyson's balance and reflexes weren't the same. That makes things like accuracy a factor. Like Magna says, that style is a 100% type of style. If a guy is only at 90%, it fails. At 80%, it fails miserably. It's a tightrope act and the guys are taught that style for so long that when they deteriorate just a little, everything just gets magnified.

    But an opponent has to have the tools at their disposal to deal with it. No tools translates to a brutal loss. But Mike sure did become a lot easier to nullify. Lots of times in boxing that's all an opponent has to do anyway--the ability to nullify. So many people think 1 fighter has to have a distinct advantage and that just isn't the case.
     
  5. FlyingFrenchman

    FlyingFrenchman Active Member Full Member

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    To be honest, after he knocked the ring rust off, he looked great early in his comeback. He still had speed, power, footwork, and head movement. As his comeback went on he was hot and cold with his training... eventually his heart wasn't in it anymore.

    I think he was ready for a great form vs. Golota but Golota didn't give him one. Tyson looked good IMO but the fight was changed to a NC due to a positive teste for weed.
     
  6. PetethePrince

    PetethePrince Slick & Redheaded Full Member

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    You really get that sense with Torres in regards to the herky-jerky nature of the style. Sometimes it's easy to forget that when you see a guy as big, strong, and fluid as Tyson in a highlight video. He's just so offensively explosive; Tyson is very aesthetically pleasing to watch but I think Patterson and him are more unique in their gifts. The D'amato style is a lot more herky jerky. Insert many of a fighters & or amateurs and it looks hardly as fluid as Tyson & Patterson make it seems (I particularly remember a Russian amateur in the London Olympics that fought Tyson-esque. He was very herky jerky and Teddy Atlas commented on how he slipped side to side too far in his range of motion).

    I've always genuinely believed Tyson was slightly superior in defense than Frazier. Honestly, you make a great case though. Tyson's offensive ammunition, counter-punching ability, and even durability perhaps can often make you overestimate his defensive capabilities (Or overlooked his vulnerabilities). And when he does slip punches he looks so damn good in doing so. The other times he's just blasting guys out early. But Douglas & Ruddock really put a number on him. I mean a shellacking. It's entirely too difficult to accept Tyson being 50% of himself when he looked less stellar offensively than anything else. I'm not entirely sure how to chalk it all up. This would definitely be an interesting thread/topic to discuss as I'm almost sure your opinion is in the minority on this one.

    Your last paragraph really hits the nail on the head. These guys are just ****ing wonderful to watch. Technically perfect offensive machines. Very crowd-pleasing style.
     
  7. PetethePrince

    PetethePrince Slick & Redheaded Full Member

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    That's right, Wright used it differently. Wright had a high work-rate. Clottey & Abraham I suspect had stamina deficiencies that kept them more shelled up for all that time. Wide disparity in skill/ability working against them too in comparison to Winky, obviously. Always thought Abraham should've been taught some sort of form of the crouch. It can't compensate for a stamina vulnerability since it's taxing but it will put him better position to use his firepower and not be so predictable.

    *Edit*

    Also interested in seeing that comparison. One thing is for sure, when Tyson made you miss he made it known. Not just for his opponent for those watching. I don't just mean he made you miss and pay but I mean he made you miss by a large margin at times. A bob & weave, or Frazier's style was more subtle and not as great of a range to slip. Partially because it was more conducive for closing the gap and in-fighting rather than immediately unleashing back heavy leather. So Frazier could parry, glove-block, or dip a little and barely just barely have you miss. Maybe you grazed him or made contact more but perhaps Tyson got hit more cleanly, more often. I honestly was of the opinion that Tyson was better defensively so I'm eagerly awaiting some video example comparisons (No pressure). By the way, I'm pretty sure that all you have to do to embed youtube video is copy and paste the url at the top and just post the link. The site does all the work for you. That's how I've always done it... preview the post beforehand to make sure.