What would have happened had Pavlik and Abraham fought?

I think he's just flat-out better. Pavlik was destructive on his way to Taylor, Zuniga and Miranda were good wins for sure, won the exciting first fight, but since then looked decent but not as good against Taylor, Lockett, devastated by B-Hop, Rubio then looked lacklustre in the fight before Sergio (against an undersized no-hoped but still kept getting up) etc etc and he hasn't looked as good as before/during the first Taylor fight.

Froch shows the same mentality no matter what his performance is like. You cannot dissuade this man. Pavlik has been shown up to be mentally weak and seems to lack the killer instinct he once had. I think thi wouldve affecte his longevity as a fighter whether he walked into B-Hop or not but bumping into 'The Executioner' when he was supposed to be able to outwork him on his way to forcing a big showdown with Calzaghe, well, that really ended the party early.

Froch arguably has the stronger resume now as well.

 

Oh, and Frochy only got clipped a few times. I think Pavlik would get hit more, he'd present Abraham with more opportunities IMO.

 

froch has a better everything than pavlik.
pavlik is as on dimentional as AA is.

pavlik v AA would be a who "hits the hardest ,wins the fight, fight"

 

Interesting view Flea.... Pavlik will stand in front of Abraham I guess, which will help AA.

Just looking back though, Froch wasn't exactly mullering AA yet still managed to discourage him. Maybe it was the movement, the power of a full 168lb'er - which Pavlik probably doesn't have.

Froch is mentally stronger, unless Pavlik hurts the other guy early he does tend to shrink a little..... but I think he can definitely take one in return. Froch tells everyone he's got a McCall chin, when really he's some way short, more Lewis level.

Widdy..... I do think Froch is the better fighter, but maybe the shocker from AA flattered him a bit :think

 

I honestly believe Abraham stops Pavlik.

Abraham was a beast at 160, Pavlik has poor foot and lateral movement and would be there to be hit by Abraham.

 

Pavlik's punch output stands him in good stead early on while AA just bides time and takes shots on gloves. Pavlik picks up rounds while AA edges closer and starts to get into fight from 4th onwards.

He marks up a bit but in later stages of fight Pavlik starts to get hit more frequently and is dropped around 9 or 10 and stopped. His holding tactics don't work against AA who just unleashes a barrage of heavy shots on Pavlik who is like Bambi on Ice.

AA wins Via KO/TKO Round 10.

 

Abraham did wait around for the Pavlik fight and there was a reason it never happened, I honestly believe Pavlik didn't fancy the fight.

 

I simply think that Pavlik would have outboxed him. His versatility is underrated.

 

It's not just to do with who hits the hardest. That is underrating Pavlik's jab, his length, his work-rate. He doesn't setup to spark people with one shot like Abraham. Hitting the hardest is only Abraham's mentality, if thats the reasoning Abraham wins but it isn't that simple because Pavlik excels in far more areas and can actually win this fight on points.

Especially when he's facing somebody who goes to war (Miranda), or has poor footwork (Taylor), or is plain bad (Zuniga, Lockett). These are the fighters Pavlik excels against and the big fights he has been involved in since Taylor have not featured opponents that match this description. Especially for movement, Hopkins and Martinez have some of the best movement in the game anywhere and diffused Pavlik, exposing his ponderous movement and the fact he has the turning arc of a freight carrier. But a key point is the fact Abraham had no footwork or body movement to deal with Froch's range.

 

+ IMO how badly Abraham was exposed was even worse than Pavlik's humiliations so I find it odd how people only look at Pavlik with critical and suspicious eyes. Hopkins and Martinez, I can see getting schooled by them. They're crafty, fast, expert counterpunchers, set traps, have good defence, move well. And well, he didn't do awfully against Martinez infact.

Froch however, has not proven to be any kind of master boxer but he appeared like it on the night.

 

As I say, when Pavlik works he comes forward. He throws from mid-range then throws whilst leaning in. His defence is porous. He will give Abraham less issues than Froch IMO, whilst Abraham will not pose the threats that stationary opponents have that is better IMO; it allows Pavlik to be more aggressive and I'm confident in Abrahams power. He would hit Kelly hard a few times throughout the fight and I think he'd stop him late.

 

This is actually true, but...my question is how much does it matter? As long as Pavlik does infact punch as he comes in, what will Abraham do about it? Abraham has shown a unwillingness to counterpunch. For many reasons, he's unable to slip shots as he's stiff, his guard is rigid and covers his face so he doesn't see the full picture. He very rarely punches WITH his opponent as well, Gevor being the rare exception. Pavlik's offence is defence here, occupy Abraham with a volume of heavy shots and it appears he's fairly clueless.

Pavlik presents opportunities, but I don't think Abraham sees them let alone take advantage of them. Plus I back Pavlik to take the odd shot when needed. He's never been on his last legs from the odd punch, it took Taylor about 10 in a row. Hopkins shook him up but never in too much danger IMO and he was timing them nicely. Abraham punches with desperation at times and its hard to land absolutely on the button in desperation.

 

I think it was more to do with Abraham attitude rather Froch discouraging him.

Remember Abraham's trainer did come out and slaughter him afterwards as being big headed and told him to ship up!

 

Pavlik mid to late K.O. There is absolutely no reason to pick Abraham. He has been exposed.

 

at super middleweight
and so has pavlik