What year do you think the see-saw tilted in favour of Harry Wills over Jack Johnson

This is all true except that it was Jimmy DeForrest, Firpos trainer, who kicked Johnson out of camp, after having enlisted him to help Firpo due to Johnson whipping Firpo in sparring and making him look so bad.

 

I think prime for prime it comes down to whether or not Wills can fight on the inside. If Johnson can tie him up and render him ineffective like he did everyone else on the inside then Wills would have problems. Ive always said Johnson is a head to head nightmare for anyone because he, like Hopkins, was so good at shutting everyone down that even when he wasnt doing much he was still doing more than the opponent. He could slow the pace of a fight to suit him and render guys ineffective. Its also hard to say because Wills fought differently in his prime than he did later in his career when he had bad hands.

 

Johnson sparred Firpo before the Brennan-Firpo fight.

 

Thanks for the correction.:good

 

As regards the underlined statement that Wills would have been a better opponent for Johnson and the time line1912 being mentioned in 1912 Wills was kod in 2rds by Johnson's sparring partner George Kid Cotton 4-2-0.

Johnson had earned his legacy long before he defended against Jeffries. He had beaten:
Burns
Felix
Klondike
Kennedy
Gardner
McVey
Russell
Childs
Martin
Jeannette
Kaufman
Flynn
Ketchel
Langford
Ferguson
Fitzsimmons
Lang

 

How could Wills ever have been a worse sparring partner than Cutler ?

 

Sam Langford was a not yet at his peak when Johnson fought him, Johnson had several defeats early in his career and even at his peak lost to Marvin Hart.

Its hard to read much into Johnson's actual win over Langford seeing that Wills beat Langford many times when at his peak after losing to Langford early in his career

 

I agree 1912 was too early for Wills. My point was he was angling for a fight with Johnson, much like Langford, Jeannette, and perhaps Sam McVey were.

Do you think Wills would have been a better choice than Jim Battling Johnson ( 1913 ) or Frank Moran ( 1914 ) ? I do.

 

Langford was not at his peak ,though he had more fights under his belt than Johnson at that time. Langford undoubtedly improved Just as surely so did Johnson.

Clay Moyle probably the foremost expert on Langford now alive, stated that, in his opinion prime for prime Johnson beats Langford.

 

Not until 1915. I'm not sold on Wills ,on either his heart, or his chin.

 

The thing about Johnson is that although he lost the title, his elimination as a force in the division was somewhat artificial.

He could probably have been a significant force into his 40s.

 

I agree. And I disagree with the idea that Wills was even a contender in 1912. I certainly didnt mean to foster that idea.