Whatever Happened To Boxing's Biggest Promoter

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by mark ant, May 15, 2020.


  1. mark ant

    mark ant Canelo was never athletic Full Member

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    He should have called off the fight because Ali failed the medical, he was not fit to fight.
     
  2. Saintpat

    Saintpat Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    If he did not pass a medical exam, the commission has the legal responsibility to deny him a license and not allow him to fight.

    What’s the story behind how that happened? Or did he fail a physical and then pass another?
     
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  3. Dubblechin

    Dubblechin Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    He never failed the physical.

    Ali took multiple physicals before the fight. He passed them all. His manager negotiated the fight. Ali signed the contracts. Ali took PEDs to lose weight. His trainers TRAINED him for the fight. They all thought he was going to win.

    And then he lost BADLY.

    And they needed someone to blame. So everyone blamed Don King, because he was an unpopular character.

    Frankly, how Angelo Dundee (his trainer) walked away clean in all this has always baffled me. Good ol Angie.

    How the athletic commission walked away clean when Ali admitted afterward he'd abused pills to lose weight (took them by the handful, he said). How did that not show up on any prefight physicals or testing?

    How Ali, who admitted he was cheating and it backfired on him because he gobbled pills when he saw the weight falling off, walked away the 'victim' has always baffled me.

    Ali cheated. The commission let him slide. His trainer didn't train him properly. His manager could see it all and wanted his cut of the purse.

    Promoters don't get blamed when a fighter isn't prepared. Ever. Except when Don King was promoting.
     
  4. Dubblechin

    Dubblechin Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Ali didn't either. When he was diagnosed with it YEARS later, people looked back and said, "Ah, there were the signs." If Andy Ruiz drops dead from a heart attack in a couple years, people can go back and say "how did they let him in the ring with Joshua weighing 300 pounds? He could've died then." But that doesn't mean you looked at him entering the ring and thought he was going to drop dead.

    And Eddie Hearn isn't going to get blamed for letting the Joshua-Ruiz rematch go on (like you're blaming King for letting the Holmes-Ali fight go on.)

    This was how the Ali-Holmes fight was viewed in the final days leading up to it.

    Can you imagine, after Ali passed a battery of tests at the most pretigious health facility in the U.S., with odds dropping to nearly even, Ali weighing the lightest he'd weighed since fighting George Foreman, after reporters watching him spar a half hour straight with different opponents and looking good ... can you imagine Don King calling off the fight because he thought "Ali didn't look right to him?"

    This was how Sports Illustrated saw it, with Ali on their cover looking thin and ready. (Of course, the next week, they pretended they didn't publish this article and looked for someone to blame, too.)

    Better not sell the old man short
    Muhammad Ali-Larry Holmes title bout once figured to be a mismatch—it’ll be anything but

    https://www.si.com/boxing/2015/09/23/muhammad-ali-larry-holmes-title-bout
     
    Last edited: May 18, 2020
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  5. klompton2

    klompton2 Boxing Junkie banned Full Member

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    Im no King fan but he does seem to get the blame for a lot of problems that he didnt cause. A perfect example was Jack Newfields expose on King where he spoke extensively of how King supposedly hung Jeff Merritt out to dry. Milked him for all he was worth and then dumped him. Not true. When I was researching Merritts life for my three part series on him I found Newfields conclusions to be absolutely false. In fact it was quite the opposite. When King got Merritt Merritt was literally in jail and had been dropped by several managers because of his legal problems and heroin addiction. Drew Bundini Brown hooked Merritt up with King as a last ditch effort to help Merritt. King took Merritt into his own home, literally nursed him back to health from drug addiction, and within a year got Merritt his first and only headliner at the Garden and his two highest profile wins and the best publicity he ever got as a pro. It was literally the high point of Merritts career. King bought Merritt’s mother the first house the family had ever owned and gave Merritt a car and a monthly paycheck in addition to his ring earnings. Merritt simply couldnt stay out of trouble and once again devolved into a life of crime and drug abuse. When Merritt wound up in prison again and hooked on drugs who was there to help him when he got out? King. King got him what should have been a relatively easy win (for someone of Merritts supposed standing) in a televised undercard of the Foreman-LeDoux fight which any fighter would have killed for. When Merritt was knocked out he once again devolved into a life of drugs and crime only fighting once more (boxrec has several errors on his record). After his career was over Merritt moved to Las Vegas to be closer to his family which had relocated there in the late 70s or early 80s. Merritt would sometimes hang around when big fights were going on panhandling. Contrary to what Newfield wrote King would sometimes help Merritt by giving him money when he came around. Im not writing any of this to soften Kings image because like I said, Im no fan, but in interest of the truth the above should be stated. Its hard to imagine any other promoter doing for Merritt what King did. In fact Bob Arum had been part of the outfit that managed and promoted Merritt after Merritt split from the National Maritime Union and that outfit did pretty much hang Merritt out to dry, although with Merritts issues he was pretty difficult to handle regardless so its hard to blame anyone for not wanting to mess with him.
     
    Last edited: May 18, 2020
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  6. mark ant

    mark ant Canelo was never athletic Full Member

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    They covered it up because Ali was such a big name there was a doc about it.
     
  7. mark ant

    mark ant Canelo was never athletic Full Member

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    Ali failed a medical before the Holmes fight his parkinson`s stopped him from being able to stand on one leg, you could see from interviews near to 1980 that his speech wa slowing and his hand movements were odd and slow.
     
  8. mark ant

    mark ant Canelo was never athletic Full Member

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    Ali had parkinson`s before the fight, he admitted that in the post fight presser.
     
  9. mark ant

    mark ant Canelo was never athletic Full Member

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    This content is protected
     
  10. Dubblechin

    Dubblechin Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Most of the negative stuff (whether it's true or not) that people repeat about Don King ad nauseum seems to originate from Jack Newfield.

    A lot of people got off the hook by pointing fingers at King.

    And I really like your articles on Merritt.
     
    Last edited: May 18, 2020
  11. Dubblechin

    Dubblechin Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Yes. The 30 for 30. A bunch of guys sitting around 40 years later saying we should've known because of stuff they've read and learned in the decades since, and a bunch of guys who knew he was cheating sitting around saying they saw him taking pills, but he was in the best shape of his life, so what are you gonna do?

    Muhammad Ali passed his physicals. Muhammad Ali took PEDs. Muhammad Ali's trainers knew he was taking them. His manager knew he was taking them. The Nevada Commission approved the fighter. Dundee in that doc even says he was in the best shape of his life.

    How do you watch that and blame Don King?

    Play all the profiles and read all the articles BEFORE the fight. There were plenty. Nobody was yelling to call it off before they stepped in the ring.

    Nobody blamed Hearn for Big Baby Miller failing his PED test. Nobody blamed Hearn for Andy Ruiz entering the ring at 300 pounds. Nobody blamed Lou Dibella for Wilder putting on a 50-pound costume and standing around for 20 minutes before a fight. Nobody blamed Lou DiBella for Wilder's clumsy footwork. Nobody blamed Frank Warren when Tyson Fury blew his drug test after the Klitschko fight and gained a 100 pounds.

    But, in the 1980s, everything was Don King's fault.
     
  12. Dubblechin

    Dubblechin Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    No he didn't. Ali said I have PARKINSON'S Syndrome in the post fight press conference? Where the hell was that comment in the post-fight press conference?

    Post it or go away.

    Jesus. Unbelievable.
     
  13. klompton2

    klompton2 Boxing Junkie banned Full Member

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    I dont blame King for Ali's health issues. That was on Ali and his handlers. The sport is littered with fighters who stayed well past their expiration date. The thing about the Ali-Holmes fight that King looks bad for is how he shortchanged Ali. But here is the thing. If King offered Ali $1mil, or whatever his purse was, and then came to him after the fight and said "I dont have the money, would you accept a paper bag with $50,000 in cash?" and Ali then accepted the money ultimately some of that responsibility has to go on Ali for just accepting it and not fighting. King is still an ******* for pulling that move (and he pulled it a lot) but Ali had other options than just accepting whatever King was willing to hand him. Its kinda like when Tyson sued King, won, and then negotiated a much smaller settlement, or when Rocchiggiani sued the WBC, won a HUGE victory, and then settled a small fraction of what he was awarded in court. The other party was wrong but if you accepted the smaller sum it doesnt exactly make you look sympathetic to then complain that you were underpaid.
     
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  14. Dubblechin

    Dubblechin Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Agreed. And King did pay Ali $7 million, which people tend to overlook ... which would be a large purse now, let alone 40 years ago.

    Ali was paid A LOT for the Holmes fight. Significantly more than Larry was paid. And Ali willingly took a cash offer as a final payment.

    Today, if Ali had been caught with all those pills in his system during the postfight drug test, he'd have been lucky to walk away with a million dollar fine.

    Drug cheats also don't tend to have museums built in their name, either.

    A lot of people committing "misdeads" back then successfully shifted the focus elsewhere by pointing fingers at King.
     
  15. Saintpat

    Saintpat Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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