When Ali Came to Britain - Tonight 10:30pm

coz he was a nasty piece of work?

 

Im lukewarm with Ali myself, great fighter, very charismatic and definitely one of the most well known boxing figures of all time. I was a hugefan of him as a kid. But as ive got older its become easier to see that Ali wasnt all he was cracked up to be. His treatment of certain opponents, early involvement with the nation of Islam ,and his sometimes disespectful behaviour in general over the course of his career has soured my support of him over the years.

 

Imagine a white athlete saying that. I wonder if he would be beloved now?:verysad

 

Asking that question has effectively ****ed the thread up from a boxing point of view!

 

I didnt see the documentary. Is it worth watching if it comes back on?

Also, I'm not a massive Ali fan.

 

I dont see how you can be a boxing fan and not be a fan of Ali. Its like myself as a Liverpool fan may not entirely agree with Stevie G's stance on DJ's playing particular types of music but you cant be a Liverpool fan and not love Steven Gerrard.

Probably had the most fairytale career (had he stopped at Foreman) though his win over Spinks years and years past his best also gets a bit of credit when he could have/should have given up after being beaten by an 8 fight novice.

So an impressionable young man lashes out against all the injustices he has ever encountered by joining the black muslim brotherhood and as a result holds a few radical views. I dont know I have always been slightly drawn to cocky fighters/people in general. What I like is when somebody says they are going to do something and are capable of doing it and then do it talk the talk and walk the walk. Thats exactly what Ali was all about.

 

Nah, im more of a fan of the Joe fazier type.

I dont dislike ali greatly, but I can undersand why someone didnt like this. manner

 

Not sure if that was serious or not but it made me chuckle. It racial and religious views and beliefs don't really bother me either. I don't have any what so ever but if a man chooses to put faith in god then thats up to him, good luck. I don't like cocky fighters TBH, Naz, RJJ, Ali, that loudmouth Camacho, not my cup of tea. I wasn't keen on his behavior towards Joe Frazier either, a man who helped him out for money and to get his licence back. 1 thing that Ali shouldn't of forgotten and then after Thrilla in Manilla to ask Fraziers son to contragulate his dad rather than doing it himself:-(

 

I was being semi serious on the Stevie G thing the point still stands. I can understand people dont like cocky fighters. I am quite drawn to cocky people or at least when they fulfill their boasts but I can sort of see why people dont like that.

I have to admit the anomaly of Ali's relationship with Frazier is one that does puzzle me probably something that will never be properly understood. Both are legends in their on right. The thing about Ali's boasting was that when he said set his mind to something he meant it. He was serious. The jokes and the poems concealed a steely determination. He was an all or nothing type of guy.

 

He certainly stood firm for what he believed in:thumbsupIf i was in need of any help, say i was homeless and my mate put me up for a few weeks til i got myself sorted it would be 1 thing i wouldn't forget, or if they lent me some money when i was skint i'd do the same for them, i find it rather odd as well when he jumped all over Frazier, seemed out of character stabbing him in the back, specially when you hear him in the documentary talking about how he loved Britain for always calling him the real Heavyweight Champ, even when he just got out of prison but the yanks didn't. Said he never forgot that

 

I dont need to lecture anyone in here about Ali and his significance.

I have to admit the more I think about it the less I can make head or tail of their relationship. Its so on and off. Im going to throw it out there. Was Ali a machiavellian type. He saw that Frazier wanted to help him but secretly despised Frazier for having the belt that he always saw as rightly his. SO he played along for a while to keep Frazier sweet but when he finally got what he wanted out of him. A chance to get back was his he was happy?

The same I suppose could be said for Frazier if you were to flip it round he only campaigned and helped ALi out because really he only ever wanted to beat him there was never any real friendship therejust a motive to see ALi back fighting for the purpose of beating him.

:conf

 

I think that 99% of the time I root against the cocky one, or the one with most mainstream appeal.

Hagler > Leonard
Frazier > Ali
Lewis > Tyson
Hatton > Mayweather
Froch > Khan (I know they'll never fight but there's a rivalry there.....)

That applies in all sports, not just boxing. I prefer Murray to Henman etc. It's rare that someone can be popular in the mainstream and still be liked by me - Jason Robinson and Jonny Wilkinson are probably the most notable exceptions.

 

Khan more cocky than Froch? no way.

I like characters myself. Don't really put too much stock into what fighters say, tbh.

 

IMHO going against the mainstream is just as contrived as going with the mainstream if its the deciding factor in whether you like someone.

 

Yea, could well be, i always get the feeling deep down Frazier has always been bitter to Ali and not forgiven him