When did Muhammad Ali start being considered a all time great ?

There were some arguing the case fairly early in his career.

I think it was generally held to be true well before FOTC.

 

I'd say beating Liston put him on the cusp and he wavered there despite Liston's reputation because of the dubious nature of the first victory (I don't think the second fight affects his standing one way or the other). Beating but not blowing away Chuvalo, Patterson, Mildenberger didn't elevate him much and he remained not quite crossing the atg line until Williams and Folley. And even then there were provisos; the age of those two and Williams' injury.

The comeback wins and performance against Frazier made him bona fide atg. Then the Rumble and the Thrilla put him into that other stratosphere. For such a rare talent, looking back, it seems his rise to greatness was quite steady. He didn't burn bright and fast like other rare talents; his atg credentials seemed to accumulate steadily then exploded in 74/75. Ironic that that should happen to a speedster whose main gift was, at that point, on the wane. That's what makes him so special.

 

Ali proclaimed himself "The Greatest" in the early '64 or so...per his study of Gorgeous George the Wrestler. Obviously, Jack Johnson, Jack Dempsey, Joe Louis, Rocky Marciano, etc, could have done the same thing. But they just let their fists do the talking...and weren't as interested in the promotion end of the business (Of course Two-ton Tony Galento laid claim to the "title" also).

 

After he was exiled. He was undefeated, had beaten Liston and Patterson, had an impressive number of defenses at the time, and was incredibly dominant.

 

His comeback fights against Quarry and Bonavena seem to have swung it for a lot of people!

 

In retrospect...the Bonavena fight pointed out some possible problems with Ali moving quickly into a Title Fight with Frazier. (Even though Ringo thought Ali would win). Frazier knew then what Joe could capitalize on,....and was in his prime to do it.

 

I'm reading the OP's question as "When did the general public recognize Ali's greatness?" Not in a hindsight way - "He proved it against Frazier in 1971" - nor in Ali's own self-promotional efforts, but in a manner where the public put aside their prejudices and collectively went, "Y'know... this guy's actually GREAT."

I think the turning point was when Ali beat that unbeatable monster George Foreman in Zaire. It was then when people could give him credit for all that he'd accomplished before. He cemented his ATG status with the general public in Manila.

 

The Rumble in the Jungle

 

Their are always those too early on proclaiming an excellent fighter as an ATG. The question should be at what point did the general consensus become that Ali was an ATG. This occurred when he beat Foreman in 1974. Those still on the fence were convinced after Ali triumphed over Frazier in 1975.

 

I'd agree with the Foreman fight. Anyone not agreeing after that was simple in denial or a hater.

 

When he was exiled during his best years and it seemed like he'd never fight again, a lot of people put him alongside the greats, and rightfully so.

The standards for greatness slowly rose in the following years, but relative to his time Ali had a resume that blew most past champions out of the water.

Dominant wins over Patterson and Liston who were fringe greats themselves, tied with Charles for the second place in terms of title defenses and just a general aura of invincibility. When he dismantled a very dangerous Terrell while barely losing a round...there was no question about it.

Only Louis, Marciano, Johnson and maybe Jeffries had comparable resumes.

 

When he first beat sonny Liston. Ali achieved greatness that night therefore automatically made him a all time great.

 

I'd concur with this. People thought Liston would seriously hurt Ali ( Clay at that time ) and he pretty much made Sonny look amateurish.

 

Absolutely. That was the one which cemented Muhammad's legacy. Though the third Frazier fight was a damn good encore.