When is a fighter past prime?

Discussion in 'World Boxing Forum' started by general zod, Nov 26, 2011.


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  1. general zod

    general zod World Champion Full Member

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    My view is that the state of a fighters reflexes is the clock by which to guage which class a fighter belongs to:

    Green contender:
    Peak reflexes, but doesnt have the experience you use them to the best of their ability

    Prime:
    Peak reflexes with the experience to use them to their fullest

    Past prime:
    Reflexes have slowed down

    Shot:
    Reflexes are completely gone and shouldnt be fighting anymore.

    Applying this to Toney:
    Green until around McCallum I
    Prime form McCallum I - ???
    Past prime by the time he got to cw
    shot - post Sam Peter I

    Anyone here agree or disagree?

    ps:
    Not sure when Toney was past prime
    ​
     
    general zod, Nov 26, 2011
    general zod, Nov 26, 2011
    #1
  2. EJDiaZ

    EJDiaZ Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Pac and PBF are on Past Prime category
     
    EJDiaZ, Nov 26, 2011
    EJDiaZ, Nov 26, 2011
    #2
  3. cesare-borgia

    cesare-borgia Übermensch in fieri Full Member

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    oki oki let me try:

    Duran:

    till buchanan= green
    lightweight reign + montreal = prime
    from leonard 2- hearns= past prime
    post hearns= shot

    Ali:
    Green= till liston 2
    prime= till his forced retirement
    past prime- comeback till manilla
    shot= after manilla

    But it gets more dificult with guys like wlad,morales,pac,hopkins
     
    cesare-borgia, Nov 26, 2011
    cesare-borgia, Nov 26, 2011
    #3
  4. general zod

    general zod World Champion Full Member

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    When do you think Mayweather's prime ended?
     
    general zod, Nov 26, 2011
    general zod, Nov 26, 2011
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  5. general zod

    general zod World Champion Full Member

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    You think he was shot after Hearns?

    I agree with this
    True.

    I have read people stating that Hopkins was green until the Johnson fight. Prime from Johnson to Joppy.
     
    general zod, Nov 26, 2011
    general zod, Nov 26, 2011
    #5
  6. cesare-borgia

    cesare-borgia Übermensch in fieri Full Member

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    Yeah or even more past prime, he still did well vs moore and barkley,but obviously not the same duran from several years earlier, when would you say his shot period started?
    I would say hopkins was green till mercado 2, prime till taylro fights, past prime till pavlik and maybe physically shot after that but still able to go strong on ring iq which makes it seem he is past prime level now.
     
    cesare-borgia, Nov 26, 2011
    cesare-borgia, Nov 26, 2011
    #6
  7. tommygun711

    tommygun711 The Future Full Member

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    I disagree with this. Duran put on a great performance against Barkley, fights after he got knocked out by Hearns. After that he was shot. That was probably his last great effort.
     
    tommygun711, Nov 26, 2011
    tommygun711, Nov 26, 2011
    #7
  8. floyd_g.o.a.t

    floyd_g.o.a.t Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    According to *******s, Pacquiao has been throughout his whole career.
     
    floyd_g.o.a.t, Nov 26, 2011
    floyd_g.o.a.t, Nov 26, 2011
    #8
  9. general zod

    general zod World Champion Full Member

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    I would say he was very past prime by the time he got to mw
    Not sure. Sometime after the Barkley fight
     
    general zod, Nov 26, 2011
    general zod, Nov 26, 2011
    #9
  10. shimmy

    shimmy Boxing Addict Full Member

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    When he gets beat by somebody that wasn't fit to shine his shoes before. Like Tyson vs. McBride for instance.
     
    shimmy, Nov 26, 2011
    shimmy, Nov 26, 2011
    #10
  11. cesare-borgia

    cesare-borgia Übermensch in fieri Full Member

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    Slightly past prime since the cotto fight, might be past prime now since mosley or just bothered by the style, its not clear but he isnt the same as in 2009 but still good enough to keep up with elite level and pick up wins.
     
    cesare-borgia, Nov 26, 2011
    cesare-borgia, Nov 26, 2011
    #11
  12. cesare-borgia

    cesare-borgia Übermensch in fieri Full Member

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    Thats shot
     
    cesare-borgia, Nov 26, 2011
    cesare-borgia, Nov 26, 2011
    #12
  13. general zod

    general zod World Champion Full Member

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    I have Tyson as green until Berbick
    Prime from Berbick to prison
    Past prime post prison - ????

    Not sure when I can accurately say he was shot

    But he was definately finished by the time he fought McBride
     
    general zod, Nov 26, 2011
    general zod, Nov 26, 2011
    #13
  14. shimmy

    shimmy Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Very true.
     
    shimmy, Nov 26, 2011
    shimmy, Nov 26, 2011
    #14
  15. general zod

    general zod World Champion Full Member

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    Roy Jones
    Green: up until he fought Toney
    Prime: Toney - Johnson*

    I know he was slowing down before this, but that was due to him not taking his training as serious as he did before. I also dont believe he was parmantly damaged by the weight loss either. He was past prime after Johnson imo. Manny Steward said that if a fighter gets koed twice in a row then he can get some form of brain injury which decreases his punch resistance.

    Very past prime around the Tito fight
    Shot by the time he fought Green.
     
    general zod, Nov 26, 2011
    general zod, Nov 26, 2011
    #15
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