When was Juan Manuel Marquez's peak as a fighter?

Discussion in 'World Boxing Forum' started by Bogotazo, Oct 4, 2012.


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  1. Bogotazo

    Bogotazo Amateur Full Member

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    At what point in his career was Juan Manuel Marquez most effective and capable as a fighter?

    Note that the question is not when his prime was, as the word "prime" usually refers to the physical prime of a fighter. What I'm asking goes beyond that and tries to get at when the blend of youthful bodily athleticism, technical skill & development, and versatility most successfully complemented each other.

    Another way of looking at it might be asking the question: when did JMM have the best chance of beating or competing with the ATG's in and around his weight-class?

    This question popped into my head because Marquez is a fighter who early on possessed impressive speed and very sharp reflexes & coordination (along with punching power which has at least in part stayed with him over the years and weight jumps). The height of his physical abilities didn't overlap with the most important parts of his career, which were delayed, and they likely didn't overlap with his peak development in technical ability, as is true for most fighters.

    Then there's the fact that Marquez evolved from a hard-hitting boxer puncher in his youth to a conservative counter-puncher, and eventually an aggressive counter-puncher with more of an offensive emphasis. It's also hard to guess when watching his later fights at 135 whether certain adaptations during fights are tricks he picked up later on to adjust to different physical dynamics, or ones he had all along that he chose to employ more often in certain fights over others.

    In any case, discuss and state your pick. If you think one fight or a couple of definitive fights, or a general time period across weight classes stands out above the rest and don't fit into one of the categories given, go ahead and explain.
     
    Bogotazo, Oct 4, 2012
    Bogotazo, Oct 4, 2012
    #1
  2. Bogotazo

    Bogotazo Amateur Full Member

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    Mods, if you could somehow shorten/edit the Poll question please....
     
    Bogotazo, Oct 4, 2012
    Bogotazo, Oct 4, 2012
    #2
  3. Nonito Smoak

    Nonito Smoak Ioka>Lomo, sorry my dudes Full Member

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    Well, Chris John is an elite HOF featherweight, yet nowhere near the very top ATG's, and I thought John deserved the draw or narrow win against JMM. So by your one standard of "when did JMM have the best chance of beating...the ATG's in and around his weight-class," I'd have to consider that one of his two pinnacle fights at the weight heavily.

    It's clearly not 140+.

    I might change my mind on a whim with something like this, but I'll go with 135.
     
    Nonito Smoak, Oct 4, 2012
    Nonito Smoak, Oct 4, 2012
    #3
  4. pipe wrenched

    pipe wrenched ESB ELITE SQUAD Full Member

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    That's a tough one.

    Like you say, he has been very effective over quite a long span of time.
     
    pipe wrenched, Oct 4, 2012
    pipe wrenched, Oct 4, 2012
    #4
  5. Uncle Rico

    Uncle Rico Loyal Member Full Member

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    ...is what I think. No doubt his skill, experience and knowledge has improved since then. But naturally his speed, reflexes, etc, have also declined as he's gone up in weight and gotten older.
     
    Uncle Rico, Oct 4, 2012
    Uncle Rico, Oct 4, 2012
    #5
  6. SugarShane_24

    SugarShane_24 ESB good-looking member Full Member

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    I'd have to say when he decided to move up to 130 and 135.

    At 126, he was younger, he had explosive power, and he was faster.

    But the experience he had as he progressed, plus the wars he had against Pac, Barrera, and Diaz definitely added a lot to his fighting prowess.
     
    SugarShane_24, Oct 4, 2012
    SugarShane_24, Oct 4, 2012
    #6
  7. thewinfella

    thewinfella The Golden Boy Full Member

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    Pacquiao 1
     
    thewinfella, Oct 4, 2012
    thewinfella, Oct 4, 2012
    #7
  8. knockout artist

    knockout artist Boxing Addict banned

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    How highly do people rate Chris John's win over Marquez? How would Chris John have done against Pacquiao?
     
    knockout artist, Oct 4, 2012
    knockout artist, Oct 4, 2012
    #8
  9. MidniteProwler

    MidniteProwler Fab 4. Mayor of Aussie Boxing Full Member

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    Chris John would have beat PAC at 126
     
    MidniteProwler, Oct 4, 2012
    MidniteProwler, Oct 4, 2012
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  10. PityTheFool

    PityTheFool Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    On a purely personal level,I'm going for mid-lates.I didn't root for him when he fought Barrera,but I'm one of the few Barrera fans who on watching for the second time,think Marquez won.That was the period when I was genuinely amazed by his ring smarts and counter punching genius.
    I have a feeling one of the mods who likes Juanma might go for the Salido period and on watching a couple of those fights,he's a totally different fighter at times.But for box office appeal,the Diaz period will take some beating.
     
    PityTheFool, Oct 4, 2012
    PityTheFool, Oct 4, 2012
    #10
  11. Nopporn

    Nopporn Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    The second option is my answer.
     
    Nopporn, Oct 4, 2012
    Nopporn, Oct 4, 2012
    #11
  12. ElCep

    ElCep Guest

    He's been consistent for a long time and there has been any significant decline. I would say against Casamayor he had the maturity and experience and still the strength and freshness of a young fighter.
     
    ElCep, Oct 4, 2012
    ElCep, Oct 4, 2012
    #12
  13. randy brown

    randy brown $$$ Full Member

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    vs jaca and jandaeng
     
    randy brown, Oct 4, 2012
    randy brown, Oct 4, 2012
    #13
  14. Zopilote

    Zopilote Dinamita Full Member

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    '02-'06

    And he ****ing beat John, **** what those judges said. :deal
     
    Zopilote, Oct 4, 2012
    Zopilote, Oct 4, 2012
    #14
  15. LordJomski

    LordJomski Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Pacquioa @126? You know what? There's a reason why Pacquioa-Marquez II took a couple of years to happen.. :hey

    Yeshmagambetov, 3k Battery, and Barrera were Pacquioa's victim @126.. Knocked Marquez down three times in one round..

    Marquez was just too lucky to escape with a draw.. :yep

    Chris John? Juarez almost knocked him out.. Imagine if its Pacquioa.. :smoke
     
    LordJomski, Oct 4, 2012
    LordJomski, Oct 4, 2012
    #15
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