Where do you rank Jersey Joe Walcott ?

No Sonny, though I do think Walcott possibly tanked it on a few occasion it was against white fighters, not black fighters. Lee Q murray was # 2 ranked contender hungry for a title shot......but I agree with marcianofrasiers view on this fight. Until you can provide a adaquete source why murray quit in the fight, this fight should go as a quality win for walcott because he puzzled murray throughout the fight.

I give Walcott full credit for beating a very good boxer-puncher in Lee Q Murray

 

Mendoz your wrong. The Prime Ezzard Charles like to fight on his toes gliding and moving in and out slippery.......the prime ezzard charles stick and moved he was a counterpuncher boxer. I dont know where you get this charles like to brawl baloney because that was not charles style and film 1946-51 certainly does not show that and no matter what you say I wont ever agree with you about charles being a brawler.

 

Just to chime in a bit on the present strain of the conversation, I don't think picking Walcott over Tyson and Lewis is unreasonable, given that he was clearly capable of winning against Louis and Marciano, both of whom I rank significantly higher than Tyson or Lewis. I think this is a case where Lewis and Tyson never really fought an opponent who was much like Walcott or vice versa, which makes such an encounter difficult to envision.

Walcott was fast, strong, powerful, extremely skilled, had good stamina and a decent chin, and defeated nearly all the top heavyweights of his era. Given all of these facts, I wouldn't count him out against anyone. That said, though, Tyson and Lewis were big men with truly monstrous power, and while they may not have been as skillful as Walcott, they were far from amateurs in there. I think it would be equally foolhardy, if not moreso, to count them out.

Ultimately, on the basis of their physical advantages and their greater dominance within their eras (Walcott was certainly a stellar performer in his own era, gave a lot better than he took against top contenders and was more than a match for great champions, but he was never a genuinely dominant champion), I rank Lewis and Tyson ahead of Walcott and would make them slight favorites to defeat him were they to meet in the ring.

 

On Patterson and Charles--Patterson had quicker hands, but Charles moved much better off the film I have seen. Patterson moved forward well, but did not go straight back very well and did not have much lateral movement. Charles did. Patterson's performance against Liston was the worst I have seen from a champion on film. Not only did he fail to move, but when hurt he reached out and grabbed the rope with his left hand. When he lost his grip on the top strand, he reached for the second strand. This is really amateurish. No one will last against any top puncher fighting like that. I would assume Charles would put up a more professional performance and would end up fighting Liston more like Machen did than as Patterson did.

 

I met Walcoot in the 70's and even though he was about Liston's height,his neck,hands,head were huge,Joe Frazier impressed me for being a big man(not tall but imposing) and Walcott an older man at the time looked like a strong fit guy, who was still dangerous. Joe was always fit but was mismanaged early on and held a job as well as training. He was a late bloomer, like Hopkins,Toney,Johnson,Moore and did most of his better work in his mid to late 30's. I give him a good chance to beat Tyson,Liston,Ali, Marciano,Louis,Dempsey and anyone else but to rate him above the top 5 is hard, he was eratic at times but I still have him in my top 10 or just outside of it. Jersey Joe on a good night at the age of 34-38 on a good night was a master, who could also level you with either hand. The worst part about his power is most of the times his punches were so tricky you could not see them just feel them(he did this with Louis in 2 fight and KO'd Charles with the hook. As far as Floyd Patterson, he was not as durable as Charles and Charles was a better fighter. Patterson had slightly faster hands(the left) but overall I rate Charles higher. Patterson's experience helped him later in his career and it showed in fights with Quarry and Ellis as well as giving Ali good fights(despite and injury...But Charles also handled himself well with experience but had a more gruiling career than Floyd

 

great stuff Bummy.......my grandfather met walcott and said he had the biggest hands he'd ever seen