I honestly think Sonny's definitely a top-5 HW when he was at his best. Unfortunately--his peak years (late 1950's) are somewhat obscured in boxing history. I've often wondered if a peak trained and conditioned Liston of that time period fought the 1964 version of Ali how it might have turned out. (I'd still make Ali the favorite but I'd give Sonny a 35-40% chance at minimum of pulling off the upset.)
Liston's reign as champ was nothing...and we all know what happened in 1964 and 1965...and it basically ended when he tasted his own blood against Leotis Martin in December 1969...
I can't rank higher than top 15 someone who lost against two LHW journeyman(one started as a mw and was a bum) and someone who lost two biggest fights of his life while quiting. Top 15 for sure but no higher than that.
Unfortunately, the two defeats to Ali ruined Liston's legacy. Instead of being remembered like an undeniable ATG, Liston is mostly remembered by quitting on his stool (a big No-No) and then taking a dive with the "Ghost punch" (an even bigger No-No). As I mentioned in other threat, had Liston given a decent performance versus Ali, losing with honor, he would be regarded quite differently today.
The average general poster knows very little about boxing history before about 2001 or so. Their takes on boxing history are mostly meaningless because very few actually know a shred about what they're talking about. You're in much better company on classic for reasonable debates and knowledgeable posters on boxing history. General is fun for its liveliness and is good for news and anything current but trying to discuss anything historical is like talking to a brick wall most of the time.
Really appreciate the advice man, im really interested in boxing and love hearing new perspectives on the sport. Not sure if you know about this but is there any valuable information in the training section? I play to start boxing soon.
I've not spent much time around the training section, it's a good place to post training logs or ask about useful exercises or pieces of equipment I think
