Where does RJJ rank P4P?

That a prime Hagler was given a competitive fight by a past-prime former LW does put a bit in perspective, I think. I also think that the very easy manner of Jones' victory of Ruiz matters.

 

So if Pac moved up and beat a SMW contender, that still wouldn't count as much as if he beat Mayweather, since Maywether is much greater p4p than your ordinary SMW contender? Even a shut-out over this SMW contender would matter less than a razor thin win over Floyd? To even compare them is ridiculous? Am I hearing you correctly here?

 

Roberto Duran would go on to fight for a very long time afterward, and put in one of the finest performances of all time in 1989.

Jones' victory does indeed matter, and it's all the more noteworthy considering the ease in which the fight was won, but it's not as great as the Hagler victory, in my opinion. Not only because Marvin Hagler is a far greater fighter than John Ruiz, even at that point in his career, but the circumstances of the Jones moving up to Heavyweight almost evens itself out with Leonard not having fought for three years and having to move up a division himself.

 

Manny Pacquiao and Floyd Mayweather are now operating in the same division, so it'd be more comparable with say Pacquiao moving up after a three year lay off to beat Sergio Martinez. Would beating Martinez after a three year lay off be more impressive than him fighting and beating a Super Middleweight contender? I probably think so. That said, it's really a ridiculous comparison, seeing as Pacquiao's frame could never carry him up that far.

 

He had also lost more widely to Benitez prior to Hagler.

Well, we're not in agreement (and Leonard really only moved up from LMW - 6 lbs), but I'd say as much as it is very hard to give a definite answer on this one. I just think it's way out there to absolutely discard the comparison.

 

Not at all.

Hagler, Hearns, Benitez, and Duran are far greater scalps than Hill, Hopkins, Toney, and Ruiz.

 

That´s the bottom line.

 

because Stone Cold said so

 

I'd have him around 30-40, but I rank boxers on achievements mostly. If you rank on head to head P4P ability, he would be very high, maybe even knocking on the top 10.

 

The problem with this is that a skill set represents a fighters potential - it's partly a guess, it's how well they'd do in theory against people they never fought. Whereas a resume reflects how successful a fighter actual was in real fights.

When it comes to weight of evidence, things that actually happened are about 10 times more convincing than guesswork and speculation by boxing fans. A resume has no room for doubt. Skill set and hypothetical matchups has a lot of uncertainty, so we can't rely on it anywhere near as much.