Whether you agree or disagree, can ranking Pacquiao over Chavez be justified?

the impact of chavez is so huge that he paved way for a lot of young mexican fighters in the 90s....i hope pacquiao could duplicate that

 

It can certainly be justified imo. As of now, I still would have Chavez just a spot or so higher, but Pac definitely belongs in the same range as JCC.

 

:good they are in the same bracket along with jones and holy

 

do you have hearns in your top 35...i can't squeeze hearns in my top 40...

 

Pac needs to go undisputed at a weight now, no more picking on certain fighters. ` He needs to unify and dominate a division. If he does that, and i think he can, there is a high high P4P ranking ahead of him. But if he does not there will always be arguments that Bradley was the No1 LW at the time of Hattons fight. That Valero was avoided etc etc Chavez beat them all at 2 weights, he left no doubts and no arguments.

 

How do folks see a match between them going? Seems 135-140 would be the weight.

 

Well its clear that Pac has achievements in more weight classes and has perhaps the slightly better top names to his resume. Those are the things that count in his favour.

On the negative side, there's the fact that a lot of Pac's top wins are against fighters who were clearly on the decline. Morales (especially in the third fight), de la Hoya and Barrera (in the second fight) were clearly shot. Hatton and Morales (in the second fight) had seen better days too imo. Of course Camacho and Haugen were on the wane when Chavez beat them too, it should not be forgotten.

I still think the Meldrick Taylor that Chavez beat is a better fighter than anyone Pac has beaten. Barrera and Morales are no doubt 'greater', but Meldrick in the form he showed against Chavez was on another level imo in terms of ability.

I also think Rocky Lockridge is a name that is forgotten on Chavez's ledger. I think he is at least as good as Juan Manuel Marquez if not outright better, and Chavez was able to clearly get the better of him, something I don't think Pac has done against Marquez, though I did have Pac taking the first encounter by a few points (had the second fight a draw).

In terms of resume depth, Chavez's is deeper at the minute. I think that's pretty uncontroversial.

If we are talking dominance, I think Chavez has been the more dominant fighter. He was run close a couple of times early in his career (Laporte, Lockridge) but I think Pac has struggled more against more average comp in his early days and even smack in the middle of his prime he has found obstacles in Morales and Marquez. I don't envision Chavez ever losing to Marquez or Morales level fighters in his prime. It's one thing to get outboxed by Pernell Whitaker, it's another thing to get outboxed by Morales and Marquez.

If we simply pick a weight where we think they are best at and compare them there on a h2h basis, I think I'd pick Chavez. He is simply the more well rounded fighter. Pac may do slightly better against boxer types but Chavez is more resilient to all styles imo including boxer punchers and outright punchers. I'm not convinced Pac can take the punishment needed to beat a lot of fighters with sturdy chins and good power. That Marquez had him all wobbly in the rematch is something to look at. A question mark has to be put on his chin. We may found out more about it in the future depending on who he fights.

Head to head between them, I'd take Chavez to beat Pac pretty comprehensively for the reason that Chavez can do everything Marquez does, but in most cases does things better, including body punching, defense and he has a better chin too.

So is it justifiable to rank Pac over Chavez? Right now I wouldn't say anyone was mad for doing so, but I also wouldn't go there myself.

 

Im somewhere in between option 2 & 3 so I just voted for option 2.

To say `it cant be justified` is a bit tough on Pac because of what he has achieved, he is an ATG for sure.

I believe it can be justified but I definitely dont rate Pac higher as I thought Chavez was the better fighter with fantastic achievements himself, a real old school quality technician with the will of a lion, solid & extremely accurate.

Pac is a fantastic fighter but Chavez was superior IMO.

 

I'd say that Pac can be compared to Chavez .. But to compare either of these 2 guys to Hearns, Hagler and Jones is a stretch for me .. You can put Hopkins in with Pac and Chavez ..

Hagler, Hearns and Jones are far superior than any of the other guys mentioned in my opinion

 

I think Duran and Pryor destroy Pac at 140. I think Duran destroys Chavez but i think Chavez could take Pryor ..
Styles make fights .. As a statistical record i think Pac can be compared to Pac but if there was a showdown between the 2 at 135 or 140 i'd go with Chavez ....

I'd go with Pernell to outbox Pac comfortably too

 

Very good post :good

Ps. I scored JMM/Pac II for Marquez.