Which 5 Champs Give Ali The Most Trouble?

Both brothers are big and slow. They have that very European Olympic boxing style that all Americans laughed at during the 70s. Add to this they want to quit when they are tired and hurt. In fact both have quit when the going got too rough. Vitali sitting on his stool and Wlad with that "get me out of here look" as he gasped for air in the process of being koed by three no names. Ali would tear them a new one.

 

Do you mean twinkle-toed, feather-fisted Ali or your Mythical Ali?

 

The Ali I watched live and in person...the one rated by most as the greatest of all hwt champions. The quickest hwt ever to live.

 

They are too much like Ernie Terrell. Neither brother would get off against Ali. There have been heavyweights who would beat ALi but it is not theses two. Wrong style. Wrong size. Wrong pace. The Klitschco punch rate would not be relevent. They only throw when they can land. Leopards don't change their spots. An ALi cake walk. Same with Lewis.

Tunney
Frazier
Charles
Holyfeild
Schmeling
Dempsey
Marciano
MOORER
Holmes
Braddock
Sharkey

All have more chance against ALi's unique style than slower super heavyweights.

 

Good jab, good length, or smart pressure.

Lewis, Holmes, both Klitschkos and Louis

I see Lennox stalking and getting big uppercuts in whenever Ali holds. I don't think it'd be pretty and I'm not positive Lennox would win, but it'd be good. The Klits brothers have the length and size and boxing dimensions to trouble Ali and feed him back jabs while sneaking in the occasional right.

 

For whatever it's worth, I thought Ali performed better against Berbick in Muhammad's 1981 career finale than Greg did against Trevor in sustaining Page's first defeat a year later.

 

Lennox of 99
Vitali of 04
Tyson of 87
Bowe of 92
Holyfield of 92
Douglas of 90
Wlad of 12

all beat him no doubt.

 

Boxingwise:

Lewis
Holmes
Norton
Walcott
Louis(In two fights Louis would loose the first one, and win the second)

Frazier was tailor made for Ali, and didn't give him boxing trouble as such. What happened was that Ali met a figther with a heart that matched his own, and more so. Same thing might have happened if he fought Marciano or Dempsey.

 

Don't forget Greg had broken his right hand early in the fight.He was probably slightly ahead, or even with Trevor until that time frame of the fight.

 

Very well aware of that, but these things sometimes happen in the course of a match. Was Greg's right thumb more important to him and his style of boxing than Frazier's broken left thumb was entering the 1964 Olympic Finals?

The right is primarily used for defensive purposes anyway when fighting out of the orthodox stance, and previous opponent Stan Ward commented immediately after they fought that Page's best punch was "a fair left hook...he's fast, but not that quick."

Berbick-Page proved not to be anomalous within the broad context of Greg's career, nor do I believe it should have been the first defeat on Page's record. I thought George Chaplin should already have held two UD wins over Greg by that stage, and that Chaplin should have dethroned Page for the USBA HW Title in their 12 round rematch.

No, I do not believe Page's broken right thumb decided the outcome of Berbick. His hook and jab still should have been enough to get the job done. What really cost Greg in this one is that 220 pounds really was too low for him. He came in at 220 for Berbick and lost. Years later, he came in at 220 for Orlin Norris and got schooled. He obviously lacked strength for his rematch stoppage loss to Mark Wills at a career low 218 [after coming in too high at 242 for his first loss to Wills]. He was good at 224 for Marty Monroe, excellent at 227 for Snipes, and he beat Coetzee at 236. What he needed to do was ignore all the crap about his weight, concentrate on proper conditioning instead, and let the weight take care of itself. The Snipes-Coetzee weight range suggests what he would likely have scaled with first rate training leaving him at full strength.

 

You're a good man, thought the second Chaplin-Page fight should have been judged a draw, real close to call.Greg never was the strongest guy in the world, and in several fights he had(Ward, spots in LeDoux, Witherspoon, and especially Berbick), it showed.I could see him going in at the mid-220's, but 230 and over wasn't his best weight, he wasn't particularly impressive against Gerrie.Someone claimed that around the time of the Berbick fight, and before, Greg had a bad drug habit, but I never heard of drugs when his name was mentioned.I know it had to be embarrsassing for Greg to lose that fight the way he did.

 

Marciano...Marciano could beat him and visa versa...good match-up
Louis....Louis could beat him.....interesting fight
Frazier...Prime Frazier beat him
Walcott....Walcott in a cat and mouse and watch that hook, could go either way
Charles....close fight...Charles more durable than Patterson and crafty but Ali wins
Dempsey...watch that hook but Ali wins UD in a painful fight
Lewis....Lewis has his moments but Ali over the long haul 12-15 UD
Holmes...Ali wins but Holmes makes it interesting

 

Wlad
Holmes
Lewis
Tyson
Frazier

The first 3 have great jabs, Lennox is very quick and powerful for such a big man, so is Wlad. That's allot to overcome.

Tyson is technically 1 of the best HWs who is very very quick and obviously devastating, a far worse stylistic match than Frazier early on.

Frazier we all know about.

 

I have a hard time seeing how Tyson possibly could give Ali the most trouble. Frazier yes, but Mike has about 10% of the heart stamina and will power that Joe brought to the ring. And Ali didn't have real trouble with physical power. My guess is that Ali/Tyson would look something like Ali/Patterson. Mike would always have a punchers chance, but he's unlikely to knock Ali out. From round and on 4 he'll realize that he's up against something that he didn't even knew the excistence of.