Which heavyweight champion hurt his legacy the most by retiring in his prime or near

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by Mendoza, Feb 29, 2016.


  1. Mendoza

    Mendoza Hrgovic = Next Heavyweight champion of the world. banned Full Member

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    Which heavyweight champion hurt his legacy the most by retiring in his prime or near prime?


    1 ) Tunney. Retired at age 31. Fights with Schmeling, Sharkey or Baer could have been made from 1929-1932. I'd favor Tunney to win all of them, and with such a short title reign, surely Tunney's historical ranking would have gone up.


    2 ) Jeffries. Retired at age 29, about the time he hit his peak. Jeffries at the time was undefeated. Fights with Hart, Johnson, O'Brien, Burns, or Lang were possibilities from 1904-1908. Jeffries said he fight Hart after he defeated Johnson if there was demand for it. While none of the above were big names post-Hart vs Johnson they would be top 4-6 type of wins for him. A huge benefit for Jeffries would have been a clear film. By 1905 the people making and capturing the films became much better.


    3 ) Marciano. Retired at age 32. Rocky was one win away from 50-0 and said he probably had 1-2 more fight left in him. Rockey had more to lose than gain but a win over Patterson or Jackson in 1956 would have given him even greater status.


    4 ) Mike Spinks. Spinks retired at age 32, after a blowout loss to Tyson. He could, however, have fought on and by beating a ranked heavyweight in 1989 or 1990 would be viewed more positively today.
     
  2. heerko koois

    heerko koois Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Spinks ( bacause of his first round loss )
     
  3. Mendoza

    Mendoza Hrgovic = Next Heavyweight champion of the world. banned Full Member

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    Spinks seemed to be breaking down when he met Tyson.

    Psychologically speaking, I think he would have a tough time overcoming the 93-second defeat. I actually think in his case he loses again if matches vs. a top 10 man.
     
  4. lufcrazy

    lufcrazy requiescat in pace Full Member

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    Without doubt Jeffries.

    Tunney is considered a great by most, although some feel he was a bit protected and hid behind a colour line. But the fights he did have, he looked good in.

    Spinks is a bit like Tunney but only instead of shot Dempsey he had prime Tyson there.

    Marciano maybe could have beaten Valdes but short of defeating a world class SHW, there's no way he improves himself.

    Jeffries retired very early without facing the best black contenders, especially those about to hit the world scene big time. He could have stayed around and defeated Johnson, McVey and Jeanette. Probably ensures he's a top 3 lock today.
     
  5. HerolGee

    HerolGee Loyal Member banned Full Member

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    tunny got lucky with jack being out of shape, he was bound to lose at some point.

    yes he would have added easily.

    Marciano was going to get found out at some point, that's why he left the scene. Patterson, Liston and especially Ali's arrival would have ripped him apart, and I think he knew it. It was only the emergence of "easy-pickings" Ingemar lucking past Patterson that made him consider coming back.

    I am surprised he was 32 though, he looked a lot older.

    I think he knew his innings was over too.
     
  6. fists of fury

    fists of fury Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    I'm not sure any of them damaged their legacies if I'm honest.
    Of those listed, maybe Jeffries.
    But how much more could any of these guys have really enhamced their legacies?
     
  7. fists of fury

    fists of fury Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Found out?
     
  8. Nighttrain

    Nighttrain 'BOUT IT 'BOUT IT Full Member

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    I don't think any of them hurt their legacy by retiring.
    A big part of Marciano's mystique was is 0.
    The lack of film makes many seem mythical.
    I don't think Spinks was prime when he retired.
     
  9. HerolGee

    HerolGee Loyal Member banned Full Member

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    yeh he was great, but at some point the lucky breaks he got facing opposition would have run dry. He would never have got lucky against Ings, Patts and Liston..perhaps just Ings.
     
  10. Mendoza

    Mendoza Hrgovic = Next Heavyweight champion of the world. banned Full Member

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    Tunney had not lost since 1922, and was 33-0-2 in his last 35 fights, many of which were vs hall of fame people, or top ten ranked people.

    I agree, Jeffries wouls have added more wins. The film I think would have been best for him. Too bad the purses dried up for Jeffries at his peak.

    What do you mean found out? Rocky wasn't going to stick around for long, he had back issues. Judging by Patterson limited punch resistance vs Ingo, Rocky would have gone 50-0. Rocky did not retire rich. His manager took way too much from him.


    Agreed on Mike Spinks.
     
  11. mcvey

    mcvey VIP Member Full Member

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    Tunney would have been favourite to beat the next three champs,imo so I pick him.
    Jeffries could and should have fought better opposition than Finnegan and Munroe,his standing with me would have been considerably enhanced if he had fought Martin,Johnson ,and McVey.
    Marciano did all that could be asked of him, he was having back problems and distrusted Weill, he was smart to go when he did. Spinks was done too imo, his knees were shot. His choice of challengers revealed his thoughts on being a long term champion at Heavyweight.
     
  12. HerolGee

    HerolGee Loyal Member banned Full Member

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    mostly below HW though. I don't consider this evidence for further performance at HW.


    I disagree, at that stage Floyds speed would have been too much for the Rock.
    By found out I mean his luck eeking out wins in fights he was losing wouldn't hold forever.
     
  13. fists of fury

    fists of fury Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Marciano didn't need to face Patterson to get to 50-0. Floyd wasn't rated in the top 10 when Marciano retired.

    Also, knowing how cautious D'Amato was with Patterson, it would be unlikely that he'd be pushing for a Marciano fight unless Marciano was seriously diminished.
     
  14. fists of fury

    fists of fury Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    I think we can all agree that Spinks was wise to retire. He basically had nowhere to go.
     
  15. Mendoza

    Mendoza Hrgovic = Next Heavyweight champion of the world. banned Full Member

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    Originally Posted by Mendoza
    Tunney had not lost since 1922, and was 33-0-2 in his last 35 fights, many of which were vs hall of fame people, or top ten ranked people.
    mostly below HW though. I don't consider this evidence for further performance at HW.