Which heavyweights could Roy Jones Jr actually beat?

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by tommygun711, May 28, 2013.


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  1. tommygun711

    tommygun711 The Future Full Member

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    Put the Jones of the Ruiz fight against some lower tier heavyweights, for example Hasim Rahman or Ron Lyle, and how does he do? Does he survive for 12 rounds? How about Patterson (not to say Patterson is a lower tier heavyweight, but he is comparable in size)

    Obviously he wouldn't stand a chance against the all time great heavyweights, although he might look nice for a few rounds before getting caught with something serious.
     
    tommygun711, May 28, 2013
    tommygun711, May 28, 2013
    #1
  2. janitor

    janitor VIP Member Full Member

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    He could probably have beaten the Tyson and Rahman of the day.

    Instead he drained himself to fight Tarver!
     
    janitor, May 28, 2013
    janitor, May 28, 2013
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  3. DaveK

    DaveK Vicious & Malicious Full Member

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    I think he does a comparable job to Patterson or Charles or Spinks at heavy.

    He wins some, loses some against the C and B-level guys.

    Guys like Lyle and Quarry probably end up trouncing him, but who knows? He may have shown some respectable amount of HW durability if he had tested himself, perhaps on the level of those I mentioned.

    I figured Ruiz would "big man" Jones and use his size on him... It could have been the broken nose and the power he felt, it could have been just being timid and not being able mentally to pull the trigger, but John couldn't do what he should have done.

    Jones may have that effect on better guys than we give him credit for. Who knows?
     
    DaveK, May 28, 2013
    DaveK, May 28, 2013
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  4. HawkFan16

    HawkFan16 Unshot/In My Prime Full Member

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    Smaller heavyweights who don't hit that hard or move that fast.

    Hence, he could beat guys like Chris Byrd, or a slow, plodding guy like David Tua anytime after 1998 (this coming from a big Tua fan.)

    I wouldn't fancy his chances of outboxing bigger guys with respectable speed/power without getting hit and going down at some point.
     
    HawkFan16, May 28, 2013
    HawkFan16, May 28, 2013
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  5. heavy_hands

    heavy_hands Guest

    banned now...
     
    heavy_hands, May 29, 2013
    heavy_hands, May 29, 2013
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  6. heavy_hands

    heavy_hands Guest

    :rofl
     
    heavy_hands, May 29, 2013
    heavy_hands, May 29, 2013
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  7. tommygun711

    tommygun711 The Future Full Member

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    Yes you seem to have a high opinion of Lyle, that doesn't change the fact that a slick fast boxer like Jones could give him some problems.

    I don't really rate Lyle's power, all of his displays of power are in losing efforts. For example, knocking out shavers is a very good win but it really doesn't show any kind of power from Lyle. It shows other attributes, like his heart and determination, but not really power. He took advantage of a fading, gassed Shavers (which I'm not mad at).

    The other example would be him dropping Foreman twice, but this is once again in a losing effort. Bugner once said something about Lyle hitting him really hard, although that's hardly substantial evidence

    Lyle's performances against Young and his leaky defense against Ali show that Jones would have a field day with his fast right hands and combinations. The one chance Lyle has is to do what Ruiz didn't and bully him on the ropes, hoping to land that killer shot.

    As far as Patterson, yeah that's tougher to say who wins because Patterson has the speed and accuracy to go with his power. I'd actually lean towards Patterson to win.
     
    tommygun711, May 29, 2013
    tommygun711, May 29, 2013
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  8. janitor

    janitor VIP Member Full Member

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    Might Jones have been a top 5 heavyweight after he beat Ruiz?
     
    janitor, May 29, 2013
    janitor, May 29, 2013
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  9. heavy_hands

    heavy_hands Guest

    SO ACCORDING YOUR LOGIC JONES WOULD OUTBOX FOREMAN ALSO RIGHT?:lol: JONES WAS NOT A HW, AND HE WOULD GET HURT BY A SIMPLE JAB OF LYLE...
    ERNIE SHAVERS RATED LYLE AT THE 3 HARDEST PUNCHER IN THE HISTORY...AFTER HIM AND FOREMAN... FOREMAN RATED LYLE LIKE THE HARDEST PUNCHER THAT HE FACED EVER(INCLUDED COONEY, WILLIAMS AND LISTON IN SPARRING SESSIONS). BUT YES TOMMY DOES NOT RATE THE POWER OF LYLE:lol:

    :rofl:nut

    SO YOU ARE COMPARING ALI AND JIMMY YOUNG WITH JONES AT HW RIGHT?:rofl
    :lol:GREAT COMMENT TOMMY YES SR :happy PATTERSON WOULD KNOCK HIM THE **** OUT
     
    heavy_hands, May 29, 2013
    heavy_hands, May 29, 2013
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  10. tommygun711

    tommygun711 The Future Full Member

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    Foreman is alot stronger and hits ALOT harder than Lyle was ever capable of. I'd pick him to bully Jones on the ropes and knock him out as soon as he corners him.

    You have to take these comments with a grain of salt, I don't really think Lyle hit harder than Cooney, Williams or Liston.. It just so happens that Foreman beat Lyle so he has to give props to him. Fighters do this all of the time, they beat a known "puncher" and then after they beat him they have to give them respect and consider them the best puncher of all time.. We all know Lyle isn't anywhere near the hardest punchers of all time.

    Shavers never fought Foreman so I'm not sure how that even makes sense. he would certainly get knocked out by George faster than he got knocked out by Lyle.

    No, as a matter of fact they are all different fighters with different styles. All i was saying is that Young and Ali both troubled Lyle with right hands, which Jones would do.
     
    tommygun711, May 29, 2013
    tommygun711, May 29, 2013
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  11. heavy_hands

    heavy_hands Guest

    REALLY? I WATCHED THE FIGHT AND THEY WERE PRETTY EVEN IN POWER AND STRENGTH...
    I WILL LISTEN THE OPINION FROM GUYS WHO FACED HIM AND TOOK HIS SHOTS , YOU CAN SAY WHAT YOU WANT.
    SHAVERS NEVER FOUGHT FOREMAN BUT HE FACED LYLE , IT IS THE POINT, ALL WE KNOW THAT FOREMAN WAS A HUGE PUNCHER, I AM TALKING ABOUT LYLE, SHAVERS AND FOREMAN RATED HIM AT A HUGE PUNCHER, FOREMAN DID PUT HIM ABOVE MORRISON,COONEY,WILLIAMS AND LISTON.
    AND WHO IS TALKING ABOUT FOREMAN VS SHAVERS?:nut


    SO EVERY FIGHTER WITH A RIGHT HAND WOULD TROUBLE LYLE RIGHT?:lol:
    ALI AND JIMM YOUNG WERE DURABLE HWS, AND THEY WERE 6´2 AND 6´3 WITH LONG REACH,AND JONES HAD AVERAGE CHIN EVEN AT SUPER MW, AND HE WAS 5´10... DO YOU UNDERSTAND THE DIFFERENCE?
     
    heavy_hands, May 29, 2013
    heavy_hands, May 29, 2013
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  12. tommygun711

    tommygun711 The Future Full Member

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    Only because Foreman was unmotivated and probably underestimated Lyle. He was wide open for Lyle's shots.

    It doesn't really matter if his mythical power didn't translate to fights. For example you can't use a sparring session or heresay as proof of Lyle's power. The reality is Lyle couldn't exhibit his "great power" in actual fights which is what matters most.

    Shavers is notorious for his shaky chin so I don't know how much credit you want to give Lyle for knocking him out. He still had to wear him out before he was able to get the knockout. Hardly a sign of his bonecrushing power, regardless of what Shavers says. If you noticed, Foreman says a bunch of bull**** that you can find even in his commentary. He says Lyle is the hardest puncher, than he says Cooney is. These fighters obviously just say what they feel or what Foreman feels would be politically correct.

    Another difference is that Jones was faster than this version of ali and faster than Jimmy Young. He threw better combinations. The angles he would show Lyle would confuse him. Lyle's only chance is to win is by knockout but that only happens if he catches Jones slipping or pins him on the ropes, like he would need to. He would need a sustained body attack and I'm not convinced that Lyle even has the finishing ability to put the slippery Jones away.
     
    tommygun711, May 29, 2013
    tommygun711, May 29, 2013
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  13. PowerPuncher

    PowerPuncher Loyal Member Full Member

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    Well the slower guys who couldn't cut off the ring and the guys below 200lbs generally. He beats the Louis of the Conn and Walcott 1 fights for sure
     
    PowerPuncher, May 29, 2013
    PowerPuncher, May 29, 2013
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  14. mr. magoo

    mr. magoo VIP Member Full Member

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    I think Jones was ranked around #4 or #5 by the ring after he beat ruiz in that year. I was kind of wondering at the time if it might have been a good idea for him to fight Chris Byrd and see if he could get his hands on the IBF title as well.. Personally I wanted to see him fight Tarver BEFORE he moved up to heavyweight rather than after.. But no point in sulking about roads not taken.
     
    mr. magoo, May 29, 2013
    mr. magoo, May 29, 2013
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  15. heavy_hands

    heavy_hands Guest

    irrelevant, when they fought toe to toe they were pretty even, it was the only fact. simply foreman was more durable.


    yes i can, because you take shots also when you are training, bugner was a very durable guy with sturdy chin and he said that lyle did hit pretty hard, foreman had a sturdy chin and he rated lyle above morrison, holyfield, williams,cooney,liston.. in hitting power.



    earnie shavers took shots from ali during 15 rounds, shavers took tons of shots from larry holmes( hardly a light puncher) during tons of rounds, and he said that lyle did hit much harder than the peanut , you have the interview in the classic forum. foreman never said that cooney did hit the hardest, he rated cooney in the place 2. lyle was the number 1.

    so antonio tarver could destroy jones but lyle a bigger,stronger harder puncher(the only guy who dropped george foreman twice in a fight) could not do it? :lol: so what if jones was faster? lyle would hit him soon of later.
    then do ou think also that withatker, leonard, willie pep would outbox lyle right? what about robinson? they were faster ...:lol:

    STOP COMPARING ROY ****ING JONES WITH GOOD HWS!!! PLEASE!!! HE WOULD GET RAPED BY ANY DECENT HW, RUIZ WAS A JOKE!!!
     
    heavy_hands, May 29, 2013
    heavy_hands, May 29, 2013
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