Which is the best heavyweight contender never to win a piece of the title, and WHY?

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by catchwtboxing, Sep 16, 2023.



Who's the best?

  1. Elmer Ray

    6.9%
  2. Lee Q Murray

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  3. Nino Valdez

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  4. Zora Foley

    3.4%
  5. Cleveland Williams

    6.9%
  6. Jerry Quarry

    31.0%
  7. Ron Lyle

    10.3%
  8. Ernie Shavers

    13.8%
  9. Jerry Cooney

    6.9%
  10. Ike Ibeabuchi

    20.7%
  1. Barrf

    Barrf Well-Known Member Full Member

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    Quarry. Would easily have won a belt in a different era. Three of his four title shots were against Frazier, Ali, and Norton. Not exactly an easy gauntlet.
     
  2. Barrf

    Barrf Well-Known Member Full Member

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    Langford would probably be a SMW -- or lighter -- today.
     
  3. swagdelfadeel

    swagdelfadeel Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    Well I'd say a glaring omission is Machen who's wins over ranked opposition are more than I can count, but off the top of my head Meredos 2x, Valdez 2x, Miteff, Daniels, Doug Jones, Brian London, Young Jack Johnson. He was able to beat all but the very elite contenders; Williams, Folley (who I think Machen just had two bad nights against and/or was against a very bad style matchup. He was definitely the superior contender, judging by their records against common opponents), Ingo (which I think was also a fluke. He foolishly underestimated him, and approached him very aggressively withut caution as Ingo was virtually unknown) and Liston. He drew with two of them, and went the distance with three.

    Also, while at the end of his career, and a shell of himself, he ended Quarry's (who was admittedly green, though I don't think it would've made a difference) undefeated streak.
     
  4. Dynamicpuncher

    Dynamicpuncher Boxing Addict Full Member

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    I'm surprised Jimmy Young hasn't been mentioned yet he beat George Foreman for crying out loud, not to mention two schoolings over Ron Lyle. Very unfortunate to lose decisions to Ali, Norton, i also heard the draw vs Shavers was BS aswell.

    From 1974 to 1977 i think Jimmy Young could upset quite a few notable champions in history.
     
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  5. Shay Sonya

    Shay Sonya Active Member Full Member

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    The best, in alphabetical order:

    Sam Langford
    Harry Wills

    Whether either could have actually won the title in their time is certainly a complicated question, as you mentioned. I am not sure that Peter Jackson was as good as these two, but I agree that he certainly deserved a shot.

    Another complication is, sadly, what if the fights were scheduled for a certain number of rounds and there were no knockouts? Could any of the three have gotten a decision win for the title? Maybe with total domination it would have been possible?
     
  6. Seamus

    Seamus Proud Kulak Full Member

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    David Tua, a destroyer of men.
     
  7. Seamus

    Seamus Proud Kulak Full Member

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    Who did Peter Jackson beat to put him in the required company? Who better than the 4 past or future champs that Tua beat? If you include Jackson, you must include the guy who him as a fit and prime specimen to the very edge, the great Joe Goddard.

    Peter Jackson is overrated.
     
  8. catchwtboxing

    catchwtboxing Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Machon lost to foley, and I wanted to spread the eras out, so Foley and Williams got in the poll.
     
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  9. swagdelfadeel

    swagdelfadeel Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    Ike was objectively better but Tua would be 2nd imo.
     
  10. catchwtboxing

    catchwtboxing Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Some thought Tua won their fight. If they believed he won. then he would be the better of the two.
     
  11. swagdelfadeel

    swagdelfadeel Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    Yes but Folley lost to Lavaronte, Doug Jones, Summerlin, YJJ and Henry Cooper, all of whom (with the exception of Lavaronte) Machen wiped the floor with.
     
  12. Seamus

    Seamus Proud Kulak Full Member

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    Wish we had a bigger sample size to judge that.
     
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  13. swagdelfadeel

    swagdelfadeel Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    Even so, Tua lost badly to Byrd, while Ike won. Ike was the superior contender imo.
     
  14. Seamus

    Seamus Proud Kulak Full Member

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    Styles make fights, tho. Byrd could make some guys look bad, others not so much. Tua sparked out Ruiz and Moorer like no one ever did.
     
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  15. swagdelfadeel

    swagdelfadeel Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    True enough. Shame Ike went to prison. Had he been able to finish his career, we would've known a lot more about him.