Which pre-1980s fighters, 140lbs or under, would you favor over Floyd Jr?

Yeah, most think because I don't agree he was born in a stable and walks on water that I hate the guy and go out of my way to discredit him.

As I always say, I don't think he's done anything wrong it's just his record doesn't match up to quite a few other fighters for opponent quality.

 

He spoiled his way to victories against Wllliams, Pep, Montgomery. Is FLoyd a class above those guys?

And by the way, how can Angott be a class below Mayweather when his resume is roughly twice as good?

Floyd's a class above skill-wise, but not as a fighter.

 

Skill wise he's one of the best, but his achievements are probably the most overrated of all time.

 

I don't even agree with that. Not proven against a sufficient number of different stylists, mainly straight on guys whose punches he can see coming.

 

To be fair Mayweather would beat many fighters listed here.
Chocolate, Cervantes, Arguello, Rosario etc.

And very very few would have been regarded as clear favourites over Floyd.

Especially at super feather.

 

Hypothetically. I'm talking in terms of opposition actually faced.

 

are you saying n'dou, hatton, chavez, and cotto were straight on guys?!

have you ever seen them fight?? :twisted:

 

Officially he was 137 for an unofficial lightweight title

He weighed what 143 against Lamotta, something tells me he could have boiled down that massive 3lbs to 140

 

Angott beating Pep is like Mayweather beating Marquez, I'm guessing you don't rate the JMM win that highly, so be consistent

Anyway these are semantics given you generally agree with the point

 

My point was that TheSouthpaw couldn't have answered that for himself. I knew!

 

Well, Pep also beat the great lightweight Willie Joyce there. I'm not convinced Pep wouldn't have made a good fist of it at lightweight had he chose to stay there.

Marquez, let's be honest, isn't beating any good welterweight.

In any case, Angott beat a lot of great and near great fighters and deserves some respect for doing so.

He's not a John Ruiz or even a Ricky Hatton. He's a great fighter.

 

Marquez just beat a very good welterweight in Pacquaio. And is Joyce a great fighter? We know Ike Williams often threw fights, was he throwing fights against Joyce? How good was the past prime Armstrong Joyce fought?

Wait are we playing the game 'any fighter in the 40s is a great great fighter'

Angott seems to look pretty good but not great in the footage we have of him, quite left hook happy

 

Locche was pretty left hand happy as well. Does he not look great? What about Benvenuti?

 

Well, you've arguably got me there. I thought the fight was a draw myself, and I do consider the Pac he beat to be good (albeit nothing much more at welterweight).

Well, if he was throwing the fights, he was doing a great job of making them close as he possibly could, losing by split decisions. One would think he'd play it a little safer and lose clearly if he was really throwing the fights.

As for Armstrong Joyce beat, I think at the time of the first Joyce win Armstrong still had some gas in the tank. Hank would later go on to defeat Tippy Larkin, Sammy Angott and John Thomas. Three very good wins.

Only when they have the runs on the board to back them up.

Angott's raison d'etre was to win ugly. No one ever called him a stylish or particularly 'skilled' fighter. He knew how to get the W though. Proved it against guys that look much better than he does.

 

A rant on Floyd from Monte Cox :

Welterweight Ratings: Floyd Mayweather’s career does not give him a top 10 spot. Luis Rodriguez, for example, had a better career than Floyd beating Emile Griffith, Benny Paret, Hurricane Carter, Curtis Cokes, Georgie Benton and Bennie Briscoe. I cannot in all honesty put Mayweather in the top 10 welterweights based on a career of hand picked opponents and having never unified a major title. Floyd avoided fights with Mosley, Margarito and Pacquiao when they meant something. He waited for these opponents to slow down and fade before considering facing them. Mayweather just does not have the competition to be considered a true all time great. I am not convinced that Floyd would beat any of the top 10 all time welterweights.

See his list of those 10 at Cox's Corner, you get the feeling that he would make much the same argument at Lightweight as well.

He doesn't rate jr. welters which is a shame