Who’s the best trainer of all time?

Dai Dollings, Jack Blackburn, Ray Arcel, Charley Goldman and Harry Wiley

 

Brown supervised Duran's diet and was primarily known as a cut man .
Arcel devised strategy


I don't think you can put names in a list in order of expertise.
Different guys gel and some don't.
I'd mention
Futch
Arcel
Goldman
Lenny
Blackburn
Benton
Gore
McCoy
Roach
Wiley
Steward
Clancy

 

I’m sorry to say you’ve got this wrong. Brown was the man who built DURAN.

 

If you say so.
Brown probably saved Marciano from defeat when a burning substance got into his eyes in the first Walcott fight.

 

I’m not intending to be or sound discourteous but I believe it’s quite a widely held fact, at least where I’ve read and heard. Arcel came in usually at the end to learn the right plan. I didn’t know that, I only recently learned about Walcott - Marciano 1 having its own burning eye drama. Thank you.

 

I'm happy to be corrected by you,no point being on a forum if you don't learn or will not accept when you are wrong,as a recent sparring match I had with another poster concerning Marciano illustrated.

 

Amilcar Brusa, he trained 14 World Champions including Carlos Monzon. Many of you may remember Brusa, he was called in to train Tomas Molinares who kayoed Marlon Starling in July 1988 after the bell was rung, both fighters did not hear the bell. Brusa was known as the Angelo Dundee of Argentina.

 

I don't know about Angelo. Some say he was little more than a cheerleader and self-promoter. I tend to think he was a good trainer but maybe not as good as some of the others mentioned here. I never heard Ray Arcel talking about what he did for Benny Leonard or Roberto Duran. But Angelo liked to talk about the psychology he used on Ali. In doing so he took away some of the credit from Ali and gave it to his shrewd handling of the fighter.

 

In his biography Angelo complained bitterly about Ray Leonard. As I recall it, there was a money dispute. Apparently Ray didn't feel Angelo was worth what he was demanding.

 

eddie futch & georgie benton

 

Larry Holmes also didn’t want to pay Eddie Futch later in his career and let him go.

It’s not uncommon for veteran fighters who know what they need to do to decide to hold onto their money when the return on investment, so to speak, is a lot lower now that their trainers are more reinforcing old teachings than teaching them new things.

So I don’t think that’s a reflection on Futch or Dundee not being good — great, actually — at what they do, more of the fighter reaching a stage where he believes he has it covered and just needs more of a ‘minder’ to put him through the workouts. Those trainers are often still on the same percentage they got when they were doing a lot more heavy lifting (in Dundee’s case he had management and training roles with Leonard — I’d argue that no fighter was every better prepared through opponent selection to be able to handle things when rising to the top than Ray through Angelo’s careful selection of opponents who could show him different looks and provide different challenges … hell, he earned probably his entire career’s pay for vetoing Thomas Hearns as an opponent for a $100,000 fight early in Ray’s career to wait for when it was worth millions … and when Ray would be completely ready for it).

As for me, if I were a fighter getting ready for a big fight — give me Eddie Futch to map out the game plan, maybe Emmanuel Steward or Yank Durham to play the drill sergeant role in day-to-day prep and then bring in Dundee to handle the corner work. Seems like that’s the best of all worlds.

 

Holmes was/is C H E A P.

 

I can't help noticing how good the writing is on this site.

 

Jem Mace is an underrated choice, his students dominated the early gloved era.

 

Dundee was originally on a percentage,but as Leonard's purses went skywards Leonard and Mike Trainer made Angelo sign a new contract in which he would be on a fixed rate.