Who beats Ali? No hedging your bets, who do YOU pick to straight up beat him?

Prime Ali beats everyone.
No one comes close.
Too fast.
Too much energy.
Too much skill.
And definately --- no heavyweight that comes straight forward towards a prime Ali can expect to receive nothing but a beating all nite long or untill he is done.

 

I favor Ali vs. everyone. The two biggest threats I see:

1) Lennox Lewis, Very skilled, powerful, and large, with good speed. He'd have to be on his game big time to take Ali though.

2) Marciano, he was an enigma, but he was always able to hit his opponents from any angle with either hand and with power. His low crouch and constant upper body movement was very difficult to deal with. In the 69' superfight, Ali commented about how much better the old guy was than what he thought he would be. IMO he'd be tougher than Frazier, less predictable, more weapons, better stamina, and stronger

 

Don't agree imo he never saw anything like Ali. Joe Walcott and Ezzard Charles gave him trouble so how would he handle Muhammad?

 

It annoys me when Holmes & Tyson ares mentioned i respect both fighters but they was NOT in the class that ALI was back then !!!! Ali was a force of nature he wast fast and powerfull he was the "Greatest"

 

Monte Cox writes:

"The best defensive heavyweight of all time was Jack Johnson. Johnson was the best heavyweight of all time in his ability to block and counter a jab. Johnson was the best heavyweight ever at picking off and blocking punches. In the July 2, 1910 San Francisco Chronicle Stanley Ketchel described Johnson as “clever, fast, and the best blocker the pugilistic world has ever seen.” Nat Fleischer and others also described Johnson in this manner. The best way to counter a fighter who is great at blocking punches is to do what? Go to the body. Which is something that Ali did not do. From a technical aspect Jack Johnson would give Ali more problems than any opponent in heavyweight history. Ali would have far more trouble with Johnson than he did with Joe Frazier, George Foreman, and Earnie Shavers, all who were fighters who came to him.

Jack Johnson would compound the stylistic problems Ali had with Jones, Norton and Young. Historian Charley Rose, who saw both Johnson and Ali in their prime years said, (July 1966 Ring), "Johnson would have caught Clay's jabs like Willie Mays catches a baseball." Jack would block and counter Ali’s jab and neutralize, at least to some degree, his primary weapon. To make matters worse for Ali, Johnson would slide back and fight out of a defensive stance. Ali would be forced to fight as an aggressor, which is something he did very poorly. He would have no strategy to attack Johnson because had no body punching. His jab would be ineffective to the point that Ali would be confused. He would find himself in with an opponent who could counterpunch very accurately and had hand speed to nearly match his own. Jack Johnson is the one boxer who could win a decision over Muhammad Ali through near equal ability and superior technical skills."

http://coxscorner.tripod.com/beat_ali.html

 

You Idiot!!! Ali at his peak, danced 15 rounds without a problem. No economy???? The flat footed clowns, who chased him were to become tired from chasing, swinging, missing and getting belted.
Louis had economy?????? He was a non-mover. Therefore, a staionary vehicle is also economical. Joe is a target for the Ali jab and combinations... at ease.

Ali by KO 8..... If not, a rediculously easy points win.

 

prime Holmes, Tyson, Holyfied, Bowe, Lewis, and both Klits. I'm not saying i'd bet against Ali either. Laugh about the Klits but nobody wants to eat a hard jab like that and they use it well. It's a weapon. I'm not a fan either.

 

He also says that there's no way Lewis would last 2 rounds with Foreman and ranks Dempsey #5 but Marciano #11 because "Marciano beat up old and small men" [insert fancy writing style]. :nut

Just because he says so doesn't make it so. Johnson fought in a completely different era in which boxing went from a transition from wrestling+bareknuckle to gloved boxing, and as such, Johnson barely had to deal with opponents jabbing, throwing combinations, glove blocking, etc.

 

Johnson defense on film is a mixed bag at best. As an infighter, Johnson had good defense, but as an out fighter he was somewhat stationary, had a low guard, and lacked range. The films tell us this, so I believe objective hard core fans and modern historians need to take the fancy writing and historical favoritism with a grain of salt.

In news reads, Johnson was in fact out boxed by a chinny light heavy past his prime for six rounds as Champion! On film a mere contender in Frank Moran got the better of Johnson from the outside...and he's nothing special. Willard as big and slow as he was, also got the better from the outside.

Somehow I think Muhammad Ali could do a bit better than Jack O'Brien, Frank Moran, and Jess Willard in terms of landing his jab, even if Willie Mays was in Jack Johnson's corner.

 

Ali hated swarmers...Marciano...Frazier...pressure...pressure...pressure...

 

Why is the question "who would have beaten him Ali at his best"? Why is it not some one else? Why is beating him so important?

Is it because psychologically we all accept that he was the best? If so, then nobody would have an even or better chance to defeat him.

Of course, we can all discuss about who would have the best chance to beat him which is not the same as saying that they would have beaten him.

 

Which is why I don't agree with those who consistently believe George Foreman would destroy any version of Joe Frazier regardless of time or conditioning. Late 1960's Frazier would be a tough assignment for any heavyweight who faced him. Certainly the big punchers, Foreman, Liston, Joe Louis, Lennox Lewis and Tyson may hurt Joe early, but none of them are stopping 1967- 1969 Frazier. Out of the above mentioned, only Lennox Lewis makes it past the middle rounds en route to being stopped later in the fight. 12 rounds maybe, but Lewis wouldn't survive 15 rounds with prime Frazier.

 

One fighter who might have had a chance of upseting Ali who nobody mentions is Sam Langford.

Small pressure fighter...check

Great left hook...check

Highly mobile...check

Highly durable...check

First clas ring generalship...check

 

We dont have any idiots on this forum, hence we dont use the word when talking about other posters.