Who do yer favour to beat Ray Robinson at Welterweight

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by TIGEREDGE, Aug 15, 2011.


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  1. Vic-JofreBRASIL

    Vic-JofreBRASIL Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Vic-JofreBRASIL, Aug 18, 2011
    Vic-JofreBRASIL, Aug 18, 2011
    #61
  2. Son of Gaul

    Son of Gaul Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    No, not for sure...Leonard is equal to Robinson in terms of raw talent, power and athleticism. Also, don't forget that Hearns-Leonard was a one-sided affair until Tommy faded late because of heat exhaustion...Hearns has the length, hand speed, power and the arsenal to give SRR nightmares...
     
    Son of Gaul, Aug 18, 2011
    Son of Gaul, Aug 18, 2011
    #62
  3. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    Leoanrd just doesn't have anything like the demostrated KO power that Robinson has, nor the devastating upper end attacking prowess, either. Saying they are about equal in power is based upon what? Perhaps if Leoanrd had KO'd Hagler with a single punch - or even hurt him - you would have some sort of argument, but he didn't.

    Robinson devastated durable fighters with single shots and with sustained attacks both. The question isn't whether or not Leonard has equivalent power to Robinson - for which their is no evidence - but whether or not Hearns has equivalent power to Robinson.

    Nowhere on film can you see Leonard unleashing the kind of attacks that Robinson launched on film versus LaMotta and Turpin, and nowhere on film can you see Leonard landing the type of massive single shots that destroy durable chins - nor can you see Leonard crack chins remotely as good as the ones Robinson dented. I don't think it's a sensible comparison TBH.
     
    McGrain, Aug 18, 2011
    McGrain, Aug 18, 2011
    #63
  4. Tin_Ribs

    Tin_Ribs Me Full Member

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    I knew Hearns would end up with plenty of favourable mentions in this thread :twisted:
     
    Tin_Ribs, Aug 18, 2011
    Tin_Ribs, Aug 18, 2011
    #64
  5. Son of Gaul

    Son of Gaul Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    :blood...With all due respect, Hearns carried his power from WW to LHW. He is, IMO, a much bigger puncher than Robinson. The quality of his competition at cruiser can be questioned but the fact that he has several knockouts against high quality competition at 175 can not be debated IMO.
     
    Son of Gaul, Aug 18, 2011
    Son of Gaul, Aug 18, 2011
    #65
  6. Swarmer

    Swarmer Patrick Full Member

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    agreed. seems almost silly to me. i simply can't see him weathering the storm.
     
    Swarmer, Aug 18, 2011
    Swarmer, Aug 18, 2011
    #66
  7. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    Possibly, but that's hardly the point - the point is that a comparison between Hearns and Robinson based upon their respective knockouts is valid. A comparison between Leonard and Robinson is baseless.

    Hearns certainly did not ever crack a chin as good as LaMotta's, whatever weights he fought at. Arguably, he did not crack a chin as good as Fullmer's, which Robinson broke in half with a single punch. For this reason I think a comparison between Hearns and Robinson as punchers is valid.

    What makes your claim that Leonard and Robinson are equivalent punchers valid?
     
    McGrain, Aug 18, 2011
    McGrain, Aug 18, 2011
    #67
  8. PowerPuncher

    PowerPuncher Loyal Member Full Member

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    I'm not convinced he was as good a puncher as Robinson, in fact I'd say no, but it's up for debate and I certainly think he maybe the best puncher SRR faced. We're talking WW not MW and if thats the case Leonard was a great puncher. Leonard had 4 fights at MW and above 3 of them ATGs and past his prime - it's hard to judge him on those, Robinson isn't stopping Hagler either so count thatout. Robinson had countless fights that went the distance at that weight.

    [ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wpcznXrArR0[/ame]

    [ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a-sPfSjnLJw[/ame]

    [ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iGX-Bi8uSQI[/ame]

    [ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HVIgj_k9H64[/ame]

    [ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A3Jefm2s81Q[/ame]
     
    PowerPuncher, Aug 18, 2011
    PowerPuncher, Aug 18, 2011
    #68
  9. TIGEREDGE

    TIGEREDGE Boxing Addict Full Member

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    I think most agree that the only way SRR is gettin beat is if he has an off night
     
    TIGEREDGE, Aug 18, 2011
    TIGEREDGE, Aug 18, 2011
    #69
  10. PaulieJ'z

    PaulieJ'z Member Full Member

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    Robinson-Leonard would be nearly even, with Robinson a slight favorite. Think they have a triology with the third fight being an all out war.
     
    PaulieJ'z, Aug 18, 2011
    PaulieJ'z, Aug 18, 2011
    #70
  11. burt bienstock

    burt bienstock Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Sugar Ray Leonard, good as he was,would have very little chance against
    the prime Welterweight Ray Robinson,whom I saw several times. Especially if Leonard came into the ring with the nickname "sugar ". Look what SRR did to another top fighter called Sugar George Costner. Ray Robinson was so angry with Costner, that he flattened Costner TWICE in ONE ROUND.
    And so with Ray Leonard. There was only one SUGAR...
    P.S. George Costner was a great welterweight in the rich 1940s...
     
    burt bienstock, Aug 18, 2011
    burt bienstock, Aug 18, 2011
    #71
  12. TIGEREDGE

    TIGEREDGE Boxing Addict Full Member

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    I think leonard was a few notches above that costner

    A leonard Robinson match would be very competitive but I don't think leonard showed enough to beat a peak robinson. he would be fightitng a bigger more powerful version of him self
     
    TIGEREDGE, Aug 18, 2011
    TIGEREDGE, Aug 18, 2011
    #72
  13. MAG1965

    MAG1965 Loyal Member banned

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    Hearns maybe just because he had some thing which Robinson could not match like height and reach and Tommy had speed. So he could have given him trouble. With Sugar Ray Leonard, Robinson might have had him matched in every quality.
     
    MAG1965, Aug 18, 2011
    MAG1965, Aug 18, 2011
    #73
  14. El Bujia

    El Bujia Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    Name them, and actually watch the Andries stoppage before you reply. Ya know what? **** it, I'll even grant you the Andries fight. The fact is you said "several", so let's hear the others.

    Robinson's power was proven just as devastating at Welterweight, and even more so at Middleweight than Hearns' was. The fact that Hearns made a living at the higher weights has more to do with his frame than any power advantage he had over someone like Robinson. He had enough power to gain the respect of top fighters at Lt. Heavy, he was by no means a devastating puncher there.
     
    El Bujia, Aug 18, 2011
    El Bujia, Aug 18, 2011
    #74
  15. PowerPuncher

    PowerPuncher Loyal Member Full Member

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    I think Hearns hit harder than Robinson, not a better puncher but I think he hit harder. Yes Robinson has spectacular KO's over champions at MW but Hearns had far less fights at that weight and in percentage terms he wasn't as devastating as often and Hearns power could put LHWs in check, Robinson's couldn't really, Hearns was ofcourse the bigger man

    [ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mM1w2VcZT3Y&feature=related[/ame]

    Read this: Two weeks after this Shuler died..And Thomas Hearns gave back the belt to his family ,,,,Simply a CLASS ACT
     
    PowerPuncher, Aug 19, 2011
    PowerPuncher, Aug 19, 2011
    #75
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