Who do you rank higher all-time pound-for-pound: NASEEM HAMED or FERNANDO VARGAS?

Discussion in 'World Boxing Forum' started by DINAMITA, Dec 1, 2008.


  1. 196osh

    196osh Mendes Bros. Full Member

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    :good
     
  2. Pimp C

    Pimp C Too Much Motion Full Member

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    Nas hands down a borderline ATG.
     
  3. Verbalkint

    Verbalkint Member Full Member

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    Ive voted for Vargas but now im thinking i was too quick with my vote and didnt give enough thought, Naz dominated his division but it was not the deepest division in comparison to the what Vargas was faced with this is too close to call for me.
     
  4. DINAMITA

    DINAMITA Guest

    Actually it is your post which reeks of bias.

    A dominant champion over a very long period of time? What utter garbage. If you actually look back through the rankings of featherweight and the surrounding divisions at the time Naz was there you will see that guys like Erik Morales, Juan Manuel Marquez, Freddie Norwood, Luisito Espinosa, Junior Jones, and plenty more far better fighters than the absolute dross Hamed was battering through were all there to be fought, and Hamed never fought any of them. His best wins were Kevin Kelley and Vuyani Bungu - Vargas's were Winky Wright and Ike Quartey - see the difference? Look at the fighters that Morales and Barrera fought from the mid 90s to the early 2000s then look at who Hamed fought in the same period - he was anything but a dominant champion, he was an expert ducker who beat up ancient veterans, domestic nobodies, and unknown foreigners.

    And 'exposed' is, for once, the perfect word for what Barrera did to Hamed, even though many people still don't realize it. I dislike the way that word is used any time someone loses, but in this case it fits perfectly. Hamed and his followers thought he was the second coming of Ali (many still do, it was the departure of Ingle that apparently curtailed this budding GOAT :lol: ), but some of us could see the extreme flaws and limitations in his game from day one - Barrera didn't beat him on the night, he exposed these flaws and limitations that were always there. Hamed had no defence except relying on reflexes, he had no all-round boxing skills, he had nothing except raw power and speed, and his dire technical abilities were thoroughly exposed by a superior technician.
     
  5. EL-MATADOR

    EL-MATADOR Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    Fernando's wins against Winky and Quartey were better than any of the prince's wins IMO.
     
  6. riggers

    riggers Well-Known Member Full Member

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    I am amazed so many of you go for Vargas here. Nas was light years better than him. Hamed was also undisputed champion and he did that by beating all the other belt holders ie the hard way.

    Fernando was exciting and brave as hell, but his accomplishments are not up there with Naz. As for saying Vargas fought a better level of competition, not a chance. Put up their top 15 opponents and see who has the greater depth.

    Naz also beat a lot of guys that were world rated before he fought for the title, Vincenzo Belcastro in his 12th fight for example
     
  7. jase hill

    jase hill Member Full Member

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    Regardless of eithers achievment or lack of one thing that puts these two in the same bracket are their reckless belief in their one style individualy and more importantly their management who quite simply got it wrong at the crucial time
     
  8. riggers

    riggers Well-Known Member Full Member

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    I just re read his top 5 Yori Boy campas , Raul Marquez. Are either of them better than Manuel Medina or Vasquez ? Or Soto ? Or Ingle ?
     
  9. DINAMITA

    DINAMITA Guest

    Vargas's resume is clearly better.
     
  10. Fat Joe

    Fat Joe Let's have it right Full Member

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    Bungu wasn't Hamed's best win
     
  11. sdsfinest22

    sdsfinest22 Pound 4 Pound Full Member

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    ATG Hamed was 85-0 84ko as an ametuer...His only loss came to a prime Marco A Barrera..Hamed is mos def more of an atg than Feroz
     
  12. DINAMITA

    DINAMITA Guest

    Wright and Quartey are far far FAR better than ANYONE on Naz's resume, and guys like Castillejo, Campas and Marquez are as good as anyone on Naz's resume, easily as good as Medina, Vasquez, Soto... and far better than Paul Ingle.

    Naz does have things in his favour in this argument, hence why I find it difficult to separate them, but resume definitely is not one of them.
     
  13. DINAMITA

    DINAMITA Guest

    IMO it was either that or Kelley, but I go Bungu as Naz's performance was better.
     
  14. DINAMITA

    DINAMITA Guest

    Naz was not undefeated as an amateur, you are wrong.
     
  15. Fat Joe

    Fat Joe Let's have it right Full Member

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    Bungu was a SBW and he just didn't turn up that night, I've never heard anyone else claim this as Hamed's best win, I don't think it is, but maybe it's an underrated one.