Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by Combatesdeboxeo_, Jun 12, 2018.
I don't think anyone would ever get SRR at 147.
Don't forget about Hedgeman Lewis
So naturally you believe Hagler fails due to the same criteria? Never stepped up. Picked on welterweight s.
SRR at 147 be the only genuinely unbeatable fighter in history.
He may be the only exception - at WW anyway. But yes, I think that is generally true.
Very good thread Combatesdeboxeo!
Very good list and also assessment of Monzon, Arguello and Chavez. My p4p list has Arguello and Chavez next to each other - very close between them. And I'd have Monzon above them both.
No argument here. Duran at 135 isn't out of the question tho.
Funny as you pointed when chavez fought "x2" a rival but curiously you forgot making the same thing with monzón..
You did repeat the names that i said... You did talk a lot but you said nothing. Oscar de la hoya can be considered great but it does not matter because chavez lost to him and de la hoya probably beats any version of chavez taking in count his bigger natural size and style, withaker exposed chavez too. Your opinion is biased like a fanatic no credibility
Fails is a strong word, but yes, I would pick Chavez as being better pound than Hagler.
Oscar Bonavena wasn't bigger than Ali, he was smaller.
George Chuvalo was just 1 or 2 pounds heavier than Ali and noticeably shorter and less rangy.
Norton and Lyle were about Ali's size.
Ali fought and beat many fighters who were a lot smaller than himself.
Patterson, Ellis, Quarry, and I expect any one of them might feature among his best wins.
He also lost to a couple of guys who were smaller. Frazier and Spinks.
As I said Chuvalo was bigger than Ali. I actually not sure on Bonavena, and you could be right, I remembered him weighing a little more, but I guess I'm wrong. While Norton and Lyle "are about the same size" as Ali, they have physical attributes that didn't allow Ali to impose himself on them. You wouldn't look at them next to one another, or look at their fights, and think Ali is the bigger guy who had the physical advantages. If anything, it would be the opposite. Point is, them, along with Foreman and others showed me Ali could beat good fighters without needing to physically be superior to them and impose himself on them. That means more than what I saw Monzon do, which was almost always be the bigger guy who imposes himself on the smaller fighters. That won't go very far for me in a p4p discussion.
If Monzon forfeits pound for pound credits for beating up men his size or slightly smaller, Ali deserves to forfeit by the same reasoning.
The pound for pound thing probably belongs to men like Jack Dempsey and Sam Langford and Harry Greb and Bob Fitzsimmons who clearly did beat men who were significantly larger. But they all lost a few fights to small ones too, so it's hard to say.
As I said though, Ali beat Foreman, and Foreman is an ATG who was bigger than Ali. Ali beat people who he couldn't out-physical, and if anything they could out-physical him, but he won. I see nobody on Monzon's resume where he beat this caliber of fighter who had physical advantages on him. Which again is the point. I could see Ali beating some fo the SHW because of various factors, and even great SHW. I'm just not able to picture the same with Monzon beating up Cruiserweights or LHW's. Can you?