Who else is qualified for the status of GOAT?

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by Dorrian_Grey, May 7, 2024.


  1. Dorrian_Grey

    Dorrian_Grey It came to me in a dream Full Member

    2,579
    4,272
    Apr 20, 2024
    I think it's probably just a joke honestly
     
  2. HistoryZero26

    HistoryZero26 Boxing Addict Full Member

    3,929
    3,440
    Jan 6, 2024

    Tunney also has a substantially shallower loss resume. But I think the current environment has made people associate such marks with resume weakness. And this has led to a movement where a greater SOS and more losses is viewed more favorably than it would have been historically. Tunneys resume is not as good as Grebs in terms of SOS but it is good enough where beating everyone he ever fought and having a draw with Greb in H2H(I'm conceding the robbery) should carry the day. And I think when they retired it did. Tunneys stoppage rate is also twice as high as Grebs(as is Langfords). Which in the NWS era should matter.

    In terms of the Willis>Langford v Tunney>Greb comp Greb never fought for the HW title despite campaigning at the weight class. Also Willis's resume has losses with a much worse SOS than Tunneys even if said SOS wasn't Willis' fault. I don't think thats the same thing. And Langfords got a better case than Greb if we're going by the whole "small guys acheiving the most at the highest weight" angle. Langford was more successful at HW despite being a little smaller than Greb winning a HW belt at least twice and winning possibly virtually every regional belt at the weight class.

    I think generally in that time period beating everyone you fought and being the GOAT in the 2 biggest divisions kind of makes you the GOAT by default. Obviously now its 2024 thats no longer the case but I believe if someone pre 30s should be considered the GOAT of boxing it should be Tunney.

    In terms of the age thing Tunney is 3 years younger than Greb. That difference isn't immaterial but it is close enough where I don't think it should matter. Both guys were out of there by the time they turned 35. I generally believe we shouldn't be using age as an excuse for fighters in their early 30s who are fighting at a championship level. If people like Foreman and Holmes can fight for titles at 45 people a decade younger should not be able to write losses against top competition a few years younger off their resume.
     
  3. Cecil

    Cecil Boxing Addict Full Member

    5,102
    5,218
    Mar 22, 2015
    Well he got me!
     
  4. Dynamicpuncher

    Dynamicpuncher Boxing Junkie Full Member

    14,809
    30,403
    Jan 14, 2022
    I only rate fighters who I've seen with my own two eyes and theres no footage of Greb. Robinson H2H looks like a modern fighter and could compete in any era, combined with his amazing record hes the clear P4P number 1 for me.
     
    cross_trainer, northpaw and Reinhardt like this.
  5. Greg Price99

    Greg Price99 Boxing Addict Full Member

    4,878
    9,373
    Dec 17, 2018
    Everyone has their own ranking criteria and you're certainly entitled to yours.

    The 4 x reasons I gave are why the vast, vast majority of posters would rank Greb above Tunney, in an all time p4p sense.
     
    JohnThomas1 likes this.
  6. Reinhardt

    Reinhardt Boxing Junkie Full Member

    13,704
    18,516
    Oct 4, 2016
    After studying Greb's career and his resume I put him in the mix for greatest of all time, and he very well may be, but as you say from what I've actually seen it's Ray Robinson.
     
    BoB Box and Dorrian_Grey like this.
  7. Mike Cannon

    Mike Cannon Boxing Addict Full Member

    4,007
    7,090
    Apr 29, 2020
    Hi Greg.
    Most, if not all right thinking boxing pundits would agree with your top 4, maybe in varying positions, what sort of stood out for me , in the last 50 + years no one has rivalled these four, and in Grebs @ Langfords case 100 years or so, when you think of all the great fighters over that period, too many to mention, it truly staggers the mind that they have remained at the apex of great champions.
    stay safe buddy, chat soon.
     
    BoB Box, Jackstraw and Greg Price99 like this.
  8. themostoverrated

    themostoverrated Active Member Full Member

    555
    647
    Feb 9, 2022
  9. HomicideHank

    HomicideHank I believe in the transmigration of souls Full Member

    776
    517
    Nov 27, 2023
    Leonard
    Greb
    Louis
    Armstrong
    Langford
    Gans
    Attell

    Amongst others.
     
    Dorrian_Grey likes this.
  10. HomicideHank

    HomicideHank I believe in the transmigration of souls Full Member

    776
    517
    Nov 27, 2023
    Tunney had a habit of picking on guys that were past their primes.
     
  11. Barrf

    Barrf Boxing Addict Full Member

    5,019
    7,642
    Sep 19, 2021
    Issue with Langford is how badly he was held back due to the color line. Never got the opportunities he deserved. And it was especially bad with him because of how high-risk he was. He'd have happily got in the ring with a white heavyweight while he was still a middleweight, but they wanted none of that due to his absurd power.

    So hard to say where he'd really have ranked. The world never got to see. What's undisputed was that he was the full package, solid technically, good chin, and absurd power.

    Love the quotes from the era about his power.

    “The hell I feared no man! There was one man, he was even smaller than I, and I wouldn’t fight because I knew he would flatten me. I was afraid of Sam Langford" -- Jack Dempsey.
     
    Last edited: May 8, 2024
  12. SwarmingSlugger

    SwarmingSlugger Active Member Full Member

    1,073
    1,330
    Nov 27, 2010
    Strongly disagree but the world is big enough for us all to have our heroes.


    I would include Willie Pep as based on pure numbers no one stacks up next to him. Hes the only fighter I know of that has 2 60+ fight win streaks.
     
    BoB Box likes this.
  13. northpaw

    northpaw Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

    17,066
    10,555
    Jun 5, 2010
    I've said this before about Greb and was verbally assaulted on here :facepalm::lol:
     
    OddR, Dorrian_Grey and Dynamicpuncher like this.
  14. Dorrian_Grey

    Dorrian_Grey It came to me in a dream Full Member

    2,579
    4,272
    Apr 20, 2024
    Agree on everyone here but curious to hear the reasoning behind Abe Attell.
     
  15. TipNom

    TipNom Active Member Full Member

    1,355
    2,791
    Jun 19, 2019
    Langford, Greb, Charles, Robinson, and Armstrong are the top 5 for me. Though I usually have Langford ranked at the top.
     
    Dorrian_Grey likes this.