Who goes 40-0 (37) the way Foreman did?

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by GOAT Primo Carnera, Aug 28, 2019.


  1. GOAT Primo Carnera

    GOAT Primo Carnera Member of the PC Fan Club Full Member

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    Lately, we´ve been discussing how overrated GF is.

    But who goes 40-0 until Ali the way Foreman did, TKO2 against Frazier + Norton and finishing until Ali with a combined 109 rounds or less? That is 40 fights a 2.7 rounds/fight avarage.

    Resume: https://boxrec.com/en/proboxer/90
     
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  2. 70sFan865

    70sFan865 Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    Foreman faced very few good fighters before Frazier. Peralta was tough for someone that inexperienced, Wepner for 4th fight is also decent, then there is Chuvalo and Kirkman. These are the only obstacles to overcome, nothing amazing for ATG fighter. You can also throw O'Halloran here, because he was big, tough and decent - these types are always tough at the beginning of career.

    The truth is that until Frazier fight, Foreman's record is almost as bad as Wilder's. The problem are Frazier and Norton fights, because to beat them you need to be really good.

    Joe Louis would definitely do that. I don't see Louis struggling against anyone here, even Frazier who wasn't at his best anymore.

    Liston can lose a fight or two, especially against Peralta as a young fighter.

    Tyson would be likely to duplicate that.

    Ali wouldn't have the same KO record, but he would go undefeated.

    Lewis shouldn't be beaten here, but he could be a bit sloppy early in his career.

    Wilder would likely lose to Peralta or Chuvalo because he wasn't refined at that point.

    Marciano should be favored over all of them, but I'm not sure how his fight with Peralta and Frazier would go.
     
  3. GOAT Primo Carnera

    GOAT Primo Carnera Member of the PC Fan Club Full Member

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    Welcome to BF24 :wave: Every fantasy fight is impossible to know, since you can´t verify something purely phantasmal.

    In therms of power, yes. The prob. of shortening a fight should corr. with functional power. As a result, it doesn´t matter in boxing if you win by decision, or knockout, you win anyway.
     
    Last edited: Aug 28, 2019
  4. Fergy

    Fergy Walking Dead Full Member

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    Not many, we may have a super super George Foreman mark 2 in the future.. Who knows?
     
  5. GOAT Primo Carnera

    GOAT Primo Carnera Member of the PC Fan Club Full Member

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    Watching this in detail lately, I was pretty surprised myself. How could he fight 4-15 Sorrel directly prior to Frazier, or guy called Joe Murphy Gordwin (1-14-1) and Clarence Boone (3-25-2) four fights prior? Didn´t they get anybody else into the ring with him?

    Regarding Wilder: I see Wilder beating Peralta and Chuvalo, but eventually don´t see Wilder stopping Chuvalo in 3.

    The Wilder bashing simply goes to far here on BF24. He could fight better opp. but stepped up his game compared to GF at fighting McCreary (14-0). After that:

    Price 13-0
    Harrison 31-6
    Scott 36-1-1
    Stiverne 24-1-1
    Molina 23-2
    Duhaupas 32-2
    Szplika 20-1
    Arreola 36-4-1
    Washington 18-0-1
    Ortiz 28-0
    Fury 27-0
    Breazeale 20-1

    Thats a tighter field than what Foreman did excluding Frazier and Norton. On the other hand, Foreman steamrolled his opp. upcoming.
     
    Last edited: Aug 28, 2019
  6. JackSilver

    JackSilver Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Weren't that suppose to be the 6'6",250Ib power punching Joshua?
     
  7. GOAT Primo Carnera

    GOAT Primo Carnera Member of the PC Fan Club Full Member

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    You don´t see AJ going 38-0 (35) against GFs opp. (excluding Frazier and Norton) ?
     
  8. GOAT Primo Carnera

    GOAT Primo Carnera Member of the PC Fan Club Full Member

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    Come on you shall guess (or evaluate a little) how other punchers might have done against Wepner, Chuvalo, Peralta, Kirkman, Frazier and Norton. Feel free to include or exclude the rest!
     
  9. GordonGarner65

    GordonGarner65 Active Member Full Member

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    These GF threads always feel like a trap waiting to be sprung on any 'Non believers' who step in the labyrinth of the patron Saint of the holy Cheeseburger grail...... or should that be grill ?

    I suspect no living mortal past or present could've dispatched such a long shelf of Tomato Cans as has ever been stacked, with such aplomb.
    In this case , what was unusual was that some of the later cans were actually of even more inferior quality to some of the earlier cans, so much so that it's a surprise some of them passed inspection as a can.
    Maybe it was feasting on such , which made the monster look still a little clumsy when trying to open the lid of tougher cans up ahead?

    Seriously its just a debate on who could beat THAT version of Frazier and Norton.
    I dont doubt that GF probably blasted the cans better than most , but there ain't many top HW's losing to anyone in that bunch.
    For me there is a longish list who I would pick over post FOTC Frazier and Norton.
    Lewis, Tyson, Holmes , Fury, Wilder, Holyfield,...maybe even throw in Tommy Morrison, Tony Tucker, Riddick Bowe etc .
     
  10. GOAT Primo Carnera

    GOAT Primo Carnera Member of the PC Fan Club Full Member

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    No its about Wepner, Chuvalo, Peralta, Kirkman, Roman, Frazier and Norton. There are arguably more who weren´t cans. Its also about:

    "Who goes 40-0 until Ali the way Foreman did, TKO2 against Frazier + Norton and finishing until Ali with a combined 109 rounds or less? That is 40 fights a 2.7 rounds/fight avarage."

    So do you only find ATGs to beat Frazier and Norton? Do they beat those two in the same fashion?
     
  11. GordonGarner65

    GordonGarner65 Active Member Full Member

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    No, I guess big George is the man.
    He'd have the lid off those cans and would eat the contents , before most others could read the label.
     
  12. The Undefeated Lachbuster

    The Undefeated Lachbuster On the Italian agenda Full Member

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    Marciano, Louis, Lewis, Liston, Dempsey

    That order is the likelyhood of them achieving it as well. Frazier and Norton, as well as the KO%, are the two biggest walls to climb for this.
     
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  13. GOAT Primo Carnera

    GOAT Primo Carnera Member of the PC Fan Club Full Member

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    Chuvalo, arguably Wepner, Kirkman, Roman, Peralta, aruably Paez, Norton and Frazier were no cans.
    So there is even no ATG you see in therms superiority in that particular run as a measurement of power?
     
  14. GOAT Primo Carnera

    GOAT Primo Carnera Member of the PC Fan Club Full Member

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    Needed 173 rounds alone until his first chance of the title. Fought another avarage (!!) 9.4 rounds in his championchip fights, and that includes a KO1 Walcott who wanted to get up! He certainly doesn´t qualify, even P4P in his era.
    Liston and Lewis had way too much UDs. Check my thread of the Liston/Tyson resume swap comp. He does not have the "killer pattern".
    Dempsey fought way too much debut fellows, firemen, cabdrivers and other half time professionals to say how he would do.

    Maybe Louis.
     
  15. Dubblechin

    Dubblechin Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    I think your numbers are off.

    Foreman's first 40 fights (through Norton) lasted 120 rounds (or less) ... not 109.

    Wilder's first 40 fights (through Ortiz 1) lasted 123 rounds (or less). And he was fighting much bigger guys overall.

    Virtually a tie.

    And I think we all know who would be mostly likely to match Foreman's record. Wilder punches a lot faster and moves in and out a lot faster than George.