Who had a great knack for the feint?

Jack Johnson was an excellent feinter.

Lucky for Muhammad Ali, he never once fought a boxer who would feint him out. Snapping his head back to dodge punches rather than blocking would get him knocked out by some of the great feinters of the past. Shame he never got to fight any of them, though.

 

^^I'm gonna politely disagree. Ali wasn't invincible during his prime. George Chuvalo managed to hit Ali flush with a hard right cross in their fight in the 1960s. Henry Cooper also managed to trap Ali against the ropes and knock him down. A technician like Joe Louis would have messed Ali up. I'd give Marciano and Walcott a good chance against Ali too.

Ali even said once that he would have trouble with Walcott's style. And if Ali were forced to play offense and try to cut off the ring on a slickster like Walcott, he wouldn't know how to go about doing it. He's used to people coming to him, rather than vice versa. The Jimmy Young fight with Ali proved exactly that, and Walcott was twice the fighter Jimmy Young was.

 

That was my pick as well :good

 

A lot of the best men here have been mentioned, Duran, Pep, Hopkins, Ricardo Lopez i have seen feint with his feet also. Even in the very short footage we have to go off, Charley urley feinted well. Johnny Tapia feinted well, or could set up shots for his man to walk onto, great chess match was him and Danny Romero.

 

Please elaborate?

There would be a lot of posturing and constant lead shifts between Johnson and Ali, each trying to bait the other.

A moving Ali operated in split seconds; I can't see him snapping his head back from a feint. He would see the bluff well in time and initiate a counter move before most spectators would even notice what had just transpired.

 

Are you implying Ali was insusceptible to feints? :huh :blood

 

Yes, but Joe Louis had fast hands, too. He could fake a jab, Ali would snap his head back, and the moment his head became available again, Joe could pop him twice!!

Unfortuneatly, we'll never see that fight. But I've always believed that Muhammad Ali was made to lose to Joe Louis. Ali had too many flaws.

 

Not exactly. But his speed, reflexes and intuition were so superior that he was simply too fast and slick to be undermined with a traditional feint game.

A feint places your opponent right where you want him. First of all, Ali was always leading, throwing the jab when the other guy was just getting set. It's hard to feint when you're constantly getting peppered with rapid fire.

Even if you could seize the initiative and feint at Ali, he worked in split seconds, and would shift minutely just out of harm's way, but not enough IMO to place him in jeopardy from a follow-up attack. Then, you would have to be fast enough to nail him solidly before he could even initiate that head slip, something fiendishly difficult.

IMO it's best to punch with Ali or counter him with the left hook.

 

This is a traditional scenario put forth by those believing Louis would destroy Ali, but it's much easier said than done.

This is how I see it: Louis feints, Ali shifts back from the waist (none of this snapping the head back) and instantly catapults forward to throw a right lead that catches an advancing Louis. I see this as more plausible simply because Ali is much faster.

Ali would hover all night at a distance where he knew he could hit Joe and not get tagged solidly in return.

George Chuvalo said, "He was just so damn fast. When he got old, it was different. But when he was young, when he moved his legs and hands at the same time, when he synchronized them, he was great. When he was young, he threw his punches when he was in motion. That is, he'd be out of punching range, and as he moved into range, he'd already begun to throw the punch. So if you waited until he got into range to punch back, he beat you every time."

And Zora Folley: "This guy has a style all his own. It's far ahead of any fighter's today. How could Dempsey, Tunney or any of them keep up? Louis wouldn't have a chance; he was too slow. Marciano couldn't get to him and would never get away from Ali's jab. There's just no way to train yourself for what he does. The moves, the speed, the punches, and the way he changes style every time you think you got him figured. The right hands Ali hit me with just had no business landing, but they did. They came from nowhere. Many times he was in the wrong position but he hit me anyway. I've never seen anyone who could do that. The knockdown punch was so fast that I never saw it. He has lots of snap, and when the punches land they dizzy your head; they fuzz up your mind. He's smart. The trickiest fighter I've ever seen. He's had twenty-nine fights and acts like he's had a hundred. He could write the book on boxing, and anyone that fights him should be made to read it."

 

^^Fantastic points. Excellent breakdown.

Ali was faster than Louis, on both hand and foot. But Joe had fast hands, too. He reminded me of a cobra. His hands were especially fast in tight spots or within mid-range.

Joe was such a technician. I think feinting is only one of the many ways he could have beaten Muhammad Ali. I can't see Ali dancing around without getting tagged by Louis' fast hands along the way in a long fight, especially against the ropes.

 

DLH was actually pretty good at economically utilizing the feint to set up power combinations (ie to determine angle of attack based on the subtle reactive body language of the psyche-outee).

 

Buster never really did anything consistently , but he could feint quite well for a big man.